Need advice!!

[OdinBB]

I know people are going to think I'm crazy for this post and I am probably going to get back lash and called a bad mom. I have been going absolutely crazy for the past few days and I need people who can give some advice who are not involved and can give a completely neutral perspective. I am undecided if I should get Odin from the humane society and allow him to finish his quarantine with me. Right now I am not sure if they will release him to me but if they would should I bring him home? I am nervous he will try to hurt my little girl. I will not let him near either of my children but there is always that what if. I don't know if I will be able to keep him from her, honestly I don't know how I did it Thursday. He is a massive dog and he is not fat or obese he is pure muscle probably close to 170 if not more. One part of me wants to get him home and he will only be in his kennel or outside and the other part of me doesn't want him here because of what he did. I am not confident his breeder or the boerboel rescue I am in contact with will be able to find someone in time and will have to put my Odin to sleep. I hate that he is there and so stressed, I know what he did but I still love him, I can't turn that off, and hate the fact he is there and so scarred. Any advice, I am ready for all of it, be honest.

 

[Hector]

If you bring him home, there is a chance that he could hurt your kids if he gets out. He could escape, kids could accidently let him out, kennel could break, etc. How long is the humane society holding him for? At this point, I would leave him at the shelter and hope someone is willing to take him.

 

[angelbears]

I think it would be a bad ideal to bring him home. He will pick up on the stress of the whole house. I think it would be worse on him. I would not chance him getting out of my back yard and getting your kids or a neighbor. I honestly believe that any dog that will attack family is highly unstable. Now add the trauma of being in quarantine you could be dealing with a time bomb.

None of us but you know the whole story. If your kids were antagonizing Odin, then I think Odin could have a chance outside of that environment. If they weren't then I think Odin is a dog that can't be trusted and the most humane thing would be to put him down.

 

[teodora]

Get him to the vet.... find a GOOD behaviorist to make an assessment on his aggression issues and then see how you can help him. 1st option - training with a good trainer, preferably remotely. Second option - if he is totally incompatible with kids (I don't think a dog cant be changed, but that's just my view) find a right environment without children around most of the time - ie a farm. Of course SOMETIMES there will be kids on any property but he can be kept away when there are visitors kids without a big impact on his general well being.I think we over-react with every dog that is put to sleep... Very few people really try to help. It's so much easier just to kill and pretend that you do it because "you have to". There's also the social pressure of "being a responsible mother" - you can be both a responsible mother and responsible for Odin's life. Even for providing him with a good life away from you, if you can't cope with the fear. Just my 2 cents.

 

[Hiraeth]

I do not think you should have him in your home, or near your children. Accidents happen and in this particular circumstance, an accident could result in death for one of your kids. That is simply not a risk anyone should take. It would be highly irresponsible of you to do so, in my opinion.

I completely disagree with teodora. Once a dog has bitten a child (multiple times), it should never be allowed around children again. It is a disaster waiting to happen. And a farm environment where there are "sometimes" kids around is just as dangerous for whatever kids happen to be there as it is dangerous for you to have him in your home. Again, it would be highly irresponsible of you, the Humane Society, and a rescue organization, to EVER put him in another household where there are children.

I advise you to be highly realistic about this situation. As angelbears said, any dog who attacks a family member is unstable, the rescue situation has probably only made him more unstable.

You MUST treat him as what he is - an aggressive, dangerous dog. It sucks. You can still love an aggressive, dangerous dog, but you love your family more, and you should be putting their needs and safety first.

 

[tmricciuto]

I truly feel for you on this one, as I've had dogs that I just couldn't trust around my kids. I would not bring that dog back into my home...if I were you. My kids/family are my number 1 priority and my pups are my number 2. It's just how it is. I do agree that he might have some type of medical issue, such as Thyroid and if that were the case he might be able to go into rescue, but I think you know what needs to be done at this point.

 

[AZ Boerboel]

I'm not saying this to be an insensitive dick head, but how could you even consider bringing him back home around your kids after what has happened? Your kid could be dead or severely disfigured right now. You got very lucky the last time he attacked that you held him off. Can you hold him off every time he attacks? Especially considering it isn't the first time he has done it there is absolutely no way I would ever have him around family again, no matter how much I loved the dog. In the early days of the Boerboel, they culled heavily to specifically avoid a dog that behaves in the manner that odin has, and would not allow its bloodline to continue. We all love our fur babies, but there comes a time when hard decisions must be made. In my opinion Odin made his decision when he attacked a child. I say this as an owner of a very aggressive dog. I know exactly what it is like to live with and control a dog that will bite. If her aggression was in any way turned towards my own children if I had any I wouldn't think twice about what needed to be done. Children, your own or another persons down the road should you choose to re home odin will be targets of him. I personally couldn't live with that.Good luck with everything you are going through.

 

[Lisa P]

I can totally feel your pain,it would not be fair to your kids to bring him home and it's not really fair to keep him at the kennel where he is being even more stressed,IF you wanted more time to get him to the Vet for testing I would have the kids spend a couple of days at a friends or families house.Norman a Cane Corso was sick from the second we brought him home with one thing after another,the last being a torn ACL caused by HD all the illness prevented him from being socialized properly, 36 vet visits in the 16 months we had him,he HATED children !! When the diagnosis of HD came we were faced with 2 surgeries except he was so agressive with the pain he wouldn't let the specialist examine him,the only way they would agree to treat him was if he was brought in sedated and taken home sedated ,he was 150 lbs and still growing.The breeder offered to take him back and try to re home BUT,,he has a 6 year old daughter ,I could not in good conscience let him go knowing he was child agressive..and we loved him so much we felt the kindest most responsible thing to do was to have him put down, it was the hardest thing we have ever had to do. We miss him every day but know that he is no longer in pain and won't kill anyone.I am truly sorry for what you are going through

 

[Lisa P]

I can totally feel your pain,it would not be fair to your kids to bring him home and it's not really fair to keep him at the kennel where he is being even more stressed,IF you wanted more time to get him to the Vet for testing I would have the kids spend a couple of days at a friends or families house.Norman a Cane Corso was sick from the second we brought him home with one thing after another,the last being a torn ACL caused by HD all the illness prevented him from being socialized properly, 36 vet visits in the 16 months we had him,he HATED children !! When the diagnosis of HD came we were faced with 2 surgeries except he was so agressive with the pain he wouldn't let the specialist examine him,the only way they would agree to treat him was if he was brought in sedated and taken home sedated ,he was 150 lbs and still growing.The breeder offered to take him back and try to re home BUT,,he has a 6 year old daughter ,I could not in good conscience let him go knowing he was child agressive..and we loved him so much we felt the kindest most responsible thing to do was to have him put down, it was the hardest thing we have ever had to do. We miss him every day but know that he is no longer in pain and won't kill anyone.I am truly sorry for what you are going through

 

[Lisa P]

Sorry that posted twice

 

[NYDDB]

I have to agree with what's been said here. I think for you, the most difficult thing is to tease out the threads of love you have for Odin, that are intertwined with the rational, objective thoughts of the very real possibility of what absolutely could happen.

Remember, the possible scenarios of him hurting- seriously hurting- your child (or any other, for that matter) are what newspaper headlines are made of...

 

[Hiraeth]

I have to agree with what's been said here. I think for you, the most difficult thing is to tease out the threads of love you have for Odin, that are intertwined with the rational, objective thoughts of the very real possibility of what absolutely could happen.

Remember, the possible scenarios of him hurting- seriously hurting- your child (or any other, for that matter) are what newspaper headlines are made of...

I had it typed out, but didn't post it earlier - this is indeed a potential precursor to newspaper headlines and tragedy. I don't want to be a fear monger and am not posting this for shock value, but a four year old boy was attacked, dragged under a fence and disemboweled feet away from his mother by a group of dogs in Detroit a few weeks ago. I cannot imagine her pain, her horror, or how she will ever recover from having lost a child in such a violent way.

Odin has displayed the warning signs that he is capable of that kind of behavior. Everyone tends to think "not me, it won't happen to me, there have been signs, but he wouldn't do such a thing", and you know what? Most of them are right. Most dogs, even human aggressive dogs, don't escalate to the point of killing a human being. But with Odin's size, power and his willingness to attack a family member (which is a tier above attacking a random stranger on the aggressive scale), there is very real potential for that to happen.

You yourself said that if you hadn't been there to pull Odin away, you'd be saying goodbye to two babies, not one. Please consider the safety of the children of everyone else as well as your own as you make decisions about Odin's future.

 

[DennasMom]

You admit you're nervous. Odin will sense that in a heart beat and be at his worst trying to figure out how to protect you from your own anxiety.

If you said you were 100% confident you could control him and keep your children safe, THEN I would say it might be ok... but if you have ONE INKLING of doubt. Don't bring him home. That won't be good for Odin, and it could be disastrous for your family.

So sorry you and your family are going through this. It could be a medical/chemical issue for Odin that may or may not be fixable with medication, but it would take time, effort and expertise to determine what the root cause is and find a solution. At this point, you just have to trust the system to help... which it doesn't always. Life sometimes just isn't fair.

 

[teodora]

H - I never said let Odin around some kids lol. I said he's not safe with kids and look for a medical condition, get an assessment if his agresiveness from a professional, pit him through an intensive training programme at a center and then, when he's considered safe by professionals, decide if you can trust him again or find him a family with no kids at the countryside somewhere.

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[teodora]

Sorry posted too quickly. And if kids will ever visit, they can keep him locked for the duration of visit. I'm those are enough precautions. Honestly, any dog can bite. ANY. Zero risk means zero dogs. Keeping Odin would not be more risky for a family wirh no kids than keeping a standard human aggressive dogs - I'm pretty sure many filas would attack a stranger kid if given a chance. Yes he's aggressive - did you get any behaviorist to evaluate him? Did you try all you can to help rehabilitate him? How do you know you "have to" put him down if you didn't?

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[teodora]

Sorry for misspelling , posting from my mobile now ...

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[OdinBB]

Thank you everyone for your advice, it is really needed. It has been a rollercoaster of emotions, I want him home but I know in my heart it can't be. I wouldn't put my children in danger like that, I just want to be able to so very badly. I know in my heart that I can't, and he is being deemed as a very dangerous animal so that takes out any potential rescue being able to legally take him. At this point I don't think that the breeder can do anything with him, I don't think she should breed his aggressive trait into her lines. She should not ever mate Odins parents to each other again for that matter. I called the humane society to see if they would release him to our vet that we have been using since we brought him home, the humane society said they would but my vet said she would not. She feels he is just too unpredictable and she does not feel comfortable with him there. That is horrible when our vet won't take him and when she hears he bit someone the news doesn't surprise her. With that being said here comes my next question, again I know I'm going to be slammed by some but here it goes. I know what I have to do, it gets clearer to me as the days go by, I hate it but it is the reality. So, should I wait for the 10 days before I do it or should I do it as soon as possible? I ask because I don't think I want there to be a chance to hurt someone else and I don't feel he should be apart of anyones breeding program either.

 

[OdinBB]

Our vets reaction a hard slap of realization........ not a good feeling at all!!!!Lisa P, oh my goodness, I am so sorry you had to go through that. You know exactly what I am going through. Thank you for sharing your story.AZ Boerboel, thank you, you are not being an insensitive dick head, I need that, that is exactly why I posted it. I appreciate and respect the advice you and everyone on this site has to offer.Theodore, I know you feel very strongly about giving him another chance and sending him to an intensive training and have him reassessed. I would if I could, it would be way too expensive and we do not have that specific training here. I would have to transport him to the closest city that offers it and also provide boarding, I feel horrible but I can't afford that, if I could I would absolutely do it. And there isn't a guarantee he would be adoptable after he is done with his intensive training. That is just not an option for our family.

 

[teodora]

I understand. I'm too far away otherwise I would take him: not to bring it home of course, but to get him evaluated and rehabilitated.... I'm pretty sure there would be farmers and hunters around here happy to have a big, strong and confident boy.

 

[Max's mom]

I love that you have such deep emotion for Odin. It is evident that you are tormented by your emotions and you want to do what is best. We had an issue with RG and my husband was snapped at while Max was in the crate (his reaction was not good) but even though he was not hurt, he was afraid of Max and told me he couldn't trust him. We worked with a trainer. Max did not attack or go after my husband...he reached in to take a fresh bone to "play" shortly after the dogs had a fight...He slammed his hand down on the top of the crate when he growled and hubs slammed his hand on the crate. Max snapped through the crate. It took a few months for my husband to really lay down and cuddle or play with him like he used to and our anxiety and fear did not help. Max could sense it and he acted up some. What about your daughter? Did she say she was afraid and ask you not to bring him home because he might hurt her? I would be very concerned about the emotional state of your daughter after such a terrifying event...and every time she walks near the dog to relive that fear...which may stimulate a similar response from Odin. Please protect your child. Sometimes love means letting go. Only you can make the decision. I wish you luck and comfort with whatever that decision is.