Experienced cc owners help!!!

Discussion in 'Cane Corso' started by Kcourtwr, Dec 24, 2020.

  1. Kcourtwr

    Kcourtwr Member

    My corso puppy is about 10 weeks old now. I brought him to a well praised trainer a couple days ago with some issues I had. We were working on training like sit, come, shake, and lay down. And he was doing good. But 2 times when letting him on the couch ( picking him up to let him cuddle with us) and moving him away from a laptop cord he wanted to chew on he growled at us and almost tried to bite. We were sceptical about this and consulted this trainer. He said we need to not practice obedience and let him enjoy life and realize how safe and great the world is first. He taught us on correcting In the moment then going back to how everything is good and that he’s a good boy. We scruff his neck for example if he is chewing on a shoe then go back to acting like everything is normal and that he’s a good pup and it was working. He explained to make when he pees inside not fun and to make bringing him outside very uncomfortable until we reach outside then back to normal. But tonight he peed on the floor and I scruffed him and went to pick him up to bring him outside and he tried to bite me I then set him back down and said no then scruffed him. At that point I couldn’t punish for the pee Becuase he already forgot but I wanted to bring him out anyways. So after a couple seconds I picked him up and he really tried to bite. He is trying to get mouthy it seems more often and getting sassy. What do I do I want him to think I’m amazing and awesome to be with not scared of me and I don’t know what I’m doing wrong. Please help I want this under control now before it’s too late. All of the research I did the trainer seemed to say was mostly wrong and I’m staring from square one educationally. Any help is appreciated
     
  2. Boxergirl

    Boxergirl Well-Known Member

    Please stop scruffing your pup. I know that trainers used to say to use that form of discipline because that's what the mother does, but that's not true. Mother dogs move their pups by picking them up by the scruff. They know how to do it and the do it gently. It's not a form of discipline for them. Scruffing frightens pups and can lead to behavior problems. The only way your puppy has to tell you he's frightened is to growl and eventually to snap or bite. I have to head out to play Santa soon, so instead of typing out all my thoughts I'm going to give you a link. The articles referenced at the bottom of the article are all from reputable and well known behaviorists. One last thought is to make sure you don't punish the growl. Dogs that are punished for growling have no way to let you know they're uncomfortable and are forced to go immediately to a bite. Growling is important communication.

    https://dogdiscoveries.com/scruff-shaking-dogs-for-discipline/

    Please also do not punish your pup for accidents in the house. Any accidents are the human's fault. If he has an accident on the floor then you weren't watching closely enough or you gave him too much freedom. He's ten weeks old and a dog. He's being asked to learn human rules in a human household. Be patient. Scruffing when you find the accident only frightens him and teaches him that you're someone to be afraid of. It sounds like you've been reading training methods that are outdated. Even your current trainer is using outdated methods. I strongly disagree with what you wrote about his suggestion for house training. Honestly, I think you're terrifying your pup with these methods. When we learn better, we do better. Behavior has come a long way since the days of scruffing, alpha rolls, and discomfort in training. Please consider abandoning punishment based training and embracing force free methods. Your pup is showing signs that he's fearful. Positive methods will work much better for him without the danger of fallout in the future.
     
    glen and timmy59 like this.
  3. Kcourtwr

    Kcourtwr Member

    Thank you for the help very much I’m willing to try anything and this point. He’s such a beautiful dog and I have wanted this puppy since I was a kid. I love him so much and want to enjoy him not be frightful of having to discipline or hurt him or make him scared of me. I never wanted to scruff him but I thought it would help. Thank you so much!
     
  4. Boxergirl

    Boxergirl Well-Known Member

    Is this your first time raising and training your own pup?
     
  5. Kcourtwr

    Kcourtwr Member

    I have raised 2 basset hour pups and then when I was a little younger I helped with a lab husky but I’ve just never had a puppy act this way before. It just blows my mind and makes me think about every thing I’m doing when I’m with the pup
     
  6. Richie

    Richie Active Member

    There is a big difference between a Basset and a CC however what you dealing with isn't specific to the CC.

    Basic obedience training should be encouraged command such as Come (with a treat waiting) is part of basic obedience training.... there should be rules and boundaries... keep is short, fun and most importantly positive.

    I think you need to spend sometime building trust between you and your puppy. Here are a few suggestions, I'm sure there are others

    1) If you are not already, hand feed your pup... there is plenty of time for him/her to eat from a bowl. While had feeding encourage the puppy to be gentle... Say it softly, they will get it.. When eating from the bowl, rub and pet while they are eating... Let the pup associate your hand with good things like food, treats, and petting
    2) Rather than lift the pup up, trying going down, sit on the floor and eventually the pup will come over and sit in your lap... that's the time to gently rub and pet. In time, when you are on the couch they will come over to be with you, than you can assist them up...
    3) Rather than scold, distract with a treat and replace with a chew toy
    4) Get your pup use to you handling them - rub his head, look in the ear, handle all four paws... If they offer up the belly (never forced), plenty of belly rubs and reward their admission with plenty of treats... I wouldn't worry too much about picking them up, they grow so fast, soon you want be able no matter how willing they are.
    5) 1:1 personal playtime ... play time where you are actively engaged...

    With a dog that could be 100+ lbs it's important to establish trust, rules and boundaries now... it's much harder to do later...

    As mentioned earlier the peeing on the floor is the parents fault not the pup's. Place and remove food and water bowls, based on their age take the puppy out on schedule and look for signs... Once the routine is established, they will let you know... It may not be the same way your Basset let you know.... but they will let know... At 10 weeks, the puppy should be taken out every 2 - 3 hours... this include early morning... for example you take them out at 8:00pm , it should be followed by 11:00pm and 2:00am, 5:00am....etc... A lot of pet owners don't want to put in that kind of time but it will payoff with little to no accidents in the house. The good news is as they get older you can extend the time between brakes... and soon you will be sleeping through the night

    Keep a long lead on the puppy even while in the house... that way when they get into something they shouldn't you can gently redirect their attention...

    Good luck raising you puppy.
     
    glen likes this.
  7. BattleDax

    BattleDax Well-Known Member

    I'm not an experienced CC owner, but I always recommend not letting the dog on the furniture. In my opinion, this has no place in training a dog and establishing pack order.

    I have no problem with the scruff shake, but I think that 10 weeks is probably too young to be engaging in corrections. After some more weeks pass, I would, however not espouse positive-only training. I think positive-only is a mistake for most dogs, especially ones that have a rather dominant temperament and some hardness to them.
     
    glen likes this.
  8. glen

    glen Super Moderator Staff Member

    I agree with all above, scruffing is a big no no in my house,
    The time and effort that you put in now with a ten week old pup will pay off big time with a fully grown cc.
    Always remember that smallish 10 week old pup is going to grow very quickly into a strong dog, what they do now and you find cute you may not find cute later.
    Take the pup out to toilet very regular, make it fun, praise them. Dont just stand there and wait for them to do it.
    Mouthing and growling is what they do in the pack, youve not had him long, make a loud noise when he does it,
    I have 3 ccs , any specific quesfions ill fry and help
     
    BattleDax likes this.
  9. Boxergirl

    Boxergirl Well-Known Member

    I'm going to put some links here from current behavior and training studies for you to take a look at. I also want to say that positive only methods are not what most people think of them as. Positive does not mean permissive. My daughter is a behavior technician/force free trainer and she works with severely reactive animals. She has never needed to punish or assert her dominance over any of these dogs. Please do read carefully the article on pack theory and dominance. It does not say that dogs don't have a hierarchy between themselves. It does explain why current research shows that dogs do not view humans as pack animals. If you'd like to read more about any of this I can give you current articles so you can make choices about your training. I'm sure those that believe in the dominance theory can supply articles as well.

    https://vcahospitals.com/know-your-...-and-pack-leadership-what-does-it-really-mean

    There are multiple links in this article that are excellent. She also has other good stuff if you look around her site.
    https://eileenanddogs.com/common-misconceptions-positive-reinforcement/

    https://www.preventivevet.com/dogs/dog-training-aversives

    If anyone is interested, I can try to find the original study, but this is a good analysis of it in a fairly concise article.
    https://drsophiayin.com/blog/entry/...og_training_techniques_can_cause_more_harm_t/
     
    glen and BattleDax like this.
  10. Michele

    Michele Super Moderator Staff Member

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