I feel Like the worst mother in the whole world...

[Rugers-Kris]

Well, I haven't needed to because I took the time to develop the trust and respect with my dogs from the beginning and neither one of them find it acceptable to "bite the hand that feeds them". I have never needed to "pin" a dog in my life nor do I suggest that, however, in the event that one of my dogs growled at me when I was trying to take something, I would not back down. I would take that item regardless. What you are teaching the dog by backing down is that if they have something they don't want to give up, they can threaten you and keep it. I have had a lot of dogs in my life and I have never had one that would growl at me or try to bite me.

"You really can't push certain dogs". I disagree. It is a lot more work with an older dog or rescue but ANY dog can be trained and respect and trust is necessary with an dog we bring into our homes.

Why is your dog so nervous with you?

I agree that when you attempt to use force, you will need to be ready for a fight but pushing through is a better idea than backing down. I'll say it again, a dog should never be allowed to get this was to begn with and if worked with when they are oung, this won't be an issue.

As for advice to the OP.......My advice would be to rehome because after reading all of the comments back forth and previous threads, it is obvious to me that she has more dog than she can handle and I think it is going to end badly for her or the dog or both.

I did continue with my "advice" simply because there are many people that read these threads and it may help one of them who have just brought a puppy home and can make a better choice.

So, what will you do in all of the stuations I named above? I see that you are saying that you use commands to avoid forcing the issue but what happens when those commands don't work and his life or someone else's depend on it? Do you back down and just wait it out?

 

[Rugers-Kris]

Also, to anyone reading this thread, I apologize for the missing letters. My keyboard has been slimed and it is just luck as to which letters will work or not and you have to push some of them really hard and I don't always remember to........

 

[ruthcatrin]

If someone else's health and well being is in the balance then I take the risk of the bite to keep that from happening. And then cope with the training problem I just caused myself.

If my dog's life and well being in the balance forcing the issue will make it worse. I'm lucky enough that my TM simply WILL NOT bolt down a high value item no matter what (seriously, he's a nut), but thats not usual. With a dog who WILL bolt down a high value item pushing in and trying to force them to give it up just makes them bolt it down faster. You're BETTER OFF taking the few seconds to find something to trade with (regardless of what it is, a SHOE if need be, it's better than something poisonous), FOR THE HEALTH OF THE DOG, than to try to force it. Because bulling in and insisting will just cause them to bolt it down faster.

And regardless, once the situation is over, you figure out a training regimen to fix the problem. But you can't create a "give me" type command if you don't reward the dog for doing so.

 

[broccolini]

Well, I haven't needed to because I took the time to develop the trust and respect with my dogs from the beginning and neither one of them find it acceptable to "bite the hand that feeds them".

I'd just like to say that I find this a bit insulting.

We were very proactive with our dogs and did all the 'trust' and 'respect' stuff with them. I still don't trust Athena not to bite me if I tried to pull some Cesar Milan crap on her. That's just not the kind of dog she is, and I could see that in her when she was ten weeks old.

Some TMs are *never* going to trust you absolutely. That has nothing to do with respect or training. I doubt there is a TM owner on this board that can say their dog cares all that much about what they want it to do.

I did a ton of research before getting a TM. None of it prepares you for the reality of living with one. Reading about how they are independent is not the same as experiencing it. I cannot emphasize enough how unlike 'normal' dogs a TM is. It's like living with a giant cat.

 

[TMmom]

I think rehoming my dog is a little harsh. I only came to this site for TM's because I haven't had one before and wanted the advice of owners with more experience and thought this would be a great place for that. I did a lot of research but what I hear from current owners really isn't addressed in the information I've read. I always ask alot of questions to fully understand things and thought this was the place for that. I will never ever get rid of my baby.

 

[broccolini]

I did a lot of research but what I hear from current owners really isn't addressed in the information I've read.

This is exactly what I was saying. All the reading in the world doesn't prepare you for the reality of these dogs. Any former dog experience you have will likely make it harder to deal with a TM. You think you can draw on that experience, but you can't. Because I can almost guarantee that a TM will not act like any other dog you've owned.

Long time owners are less helpful than newer owners, in my opinion. People who have owned them for a long time tend to forget what normal dogs are like. Talking to other first time owners gives you a better idea of the challenges of this breed. Not that you shouldn't have a network that includes long time owners, they are invaluable too.

Once you accept their oddness, they are great dogs. They are more work than most dogs, but you get used to it.

 

[Rugers-Kris]

Which is why I said you start when they are young as puppies so it is something they learn gradually before becomes as serious or dangerous. When the puppy comes home and he is carrying toys around and playing, you CAN create that command in a happy way so that they learn to not only give you whatever they have when you ask but that they want to THEN every time they do, you praise or treat and I specifically pointed out that the should be rewarded just not bribed so I am not sure why you pointed that out.

If someone else's health and well being is in the balance then I take the risk of the bite to keep that from happening. And then cope with the training problem I just caused myself.

If my dog's life and well being in the balance forcing the issue will make it worse. I'm lucky enough that my TM simply WILL NOT bolt down a high value item no matter what (seriously, he's a nut), but thats not usual. With a dog who WILL bolt down a high value item pushing in and trying to force them to give it up just makes them bolt it down faster. You're BETTER OFF taking the few seconds to find something to trade with (regardless of what it is, a SHOE if need be, it's better than something poisonous), FOR THE HEALTH OF THE DOG, than to try to force it. Because bulling in and insisting will just cause them to bolt it down faster.

And regardless, once the situation is over, you figure out a training regimen to fix the problem. But you can't create a "give me" type command if you don't reward the dog for doing so.

I am sorry you feel insulted but the reality is that I know that is why I have never faced the resource guarding with mine over all of these years. Instead of being insulted by my personal beliefs, maybe we can just agree to disagree on that particular point. I do understand that all of the research in the world will not truly make you ready for any particular breed but I still believe that respect and trust with my dogs are very important and an absolute necessity for their safety, my safety and the safety of others and I think it is possible with any dog regardless of breed. I know a couple that raises wolves and wolf hybrids and am blown away at the relationship between them and their animals, mind you...I wouldn't want to own them but to see them with them is truly amazing and there is no doubt that their entire relationship is built on respect and trust. I won't lose my cool and attack my dog and it is important to me to know that they will not attack/bite me. It is the most important part of owning dogs IMO and I work long and hard from the moment I bring them home to form a relationship that fosters such.

I'd just like to say that I find this a bit insulting.

We were very proactive with our dogs and did all the 'trust' and 'respect' stuff with them. I still don't trust Athena not to bite me if I tried to pull some Cesar Milan crap on her. That's just not the kind of dog she is, and I could see that in her when she was ten weeks old.

Some TMs are *never* going to trust you absolutely. That has nothing to do with respect or training. I doubt there is a TM owner on this board that can say their dog cares all that much about what they want it to do.

I did a ton of research before getting a TM. None of it prepares you for the reality of living with one. Reading about how they are independent is not the same as experiencing it. I cannot emphasize enough how unlike 'normal' dogs a TM is. It's like living with a giant cat.

It may seem harsh to you but I was just being honest. I would be willing to bet that there are at least a couple others that would agree with me but not openly in this thread. Again, it is just my opinion so you don't have to give it any thought at all. I was just simply answering the question I was asked with the information I had to work with. Regardless, I wish you the best with your dog and really hope it works out well...I am just not good at "going along to get along"....The truth shall set me free. LOL

I think rehoming my dog is a little harsh. I only came to this site for TM's because I haven't had one before and wanted the advice of owners with more experience and thought this would be a great place for that. I did a lot of research but what I hear from current owners really isn't addressed in the information I've read. I always ask alot of questions to fully understand things and thought this was the place for that. I will never ever get rid of my baby.

 

[Penelope's Mom]

Well, I haven't needed to because I took the time to develop the trust and respect with my dogs from the beginning and neither one of them find it acceptable to "bite the hand that feeds them". I have never needed to "pin" a dog in my life nor do I suggest that, however, in the event that one of my dogs growled at me when I was trying to take something, I would not back down. I would take that item regardless. What you are teaching the dog by backing down is that if they have something they don't want to give up, they can threaten you and keep it. I have had a lot of dogs in my life and I have never had one that would growl at me or try to bite me.

To a point, I agree with this. I never developed this trust with Franklin and I have no doubt that no matter how much he loved me, had I taken something from him he really valued, he would've come after me. I didn't take the time to build his trust and if he growled at me, I backed off. Looking back, that was the worst thing I could've done.

 

[broccolini]

I am sorry you feel insulted but the reality is that I know that is why I have never faced the resource guarding with mine over all of these years. Instead of being insulted by my personal beliefs, maybe we can just agree to disagree on that particular point. I do understand that all of the research in the world will not truly make you ready for any particular breed but I still believe that respect and trust with my dogs are very important and an absolute necessity for their safety, my safety and the safety of others and I think it is possible with any dog regardless of breed.

Yes, of course we can agree to disagree. Otherwise, we'd have to arm wrestle over it.

But what you are saying in this thread is that people only have resource guarding issues or aggression issues because they haven't done the right things. This is unfair. It would be like me telling you that Ruger doesn't like the vet because he doesn't trust you. Because if you like the vet, and he trusts you, then he should like the vet.

I did the right things with my dog when she was young. I did them a lot because I could tell that she was going to have a harder temperament. I still would not trust her to not bite me if I pushed her. And because I know how TMs are, I'll never rely on her doing anything just because it's what I want her to do. No matter how much training I put into her, she'll never be that kind of dog.

Oh, and it's not like I disagree with what you are promoting. Early training to avoid these issues is very important. It's just that after owning a TM, I'm never going to assume that someone only has problems with their dog because they failed in some way.

 

[ruthcatrin]

Which is why I said you start when they are young as puppies so it is something they learn gradually before becomes as serious or dangerous. When the puppy comes home and he is carrying toys around and playing, you CAN create that command in a happy way so that they learn to not only give you whatever they have when you ask but that they want to THEN every time they do, you praise or treat and I specifically pointed out that the should be rewarded just not bribed so I am not sure why you pointed that out.

Because we're not discussing a 10week old puppy now. We're discussing a 9month old, well grown, teenager. What SHOULD have been done is a pretty moot point now except for future reference with a future pup. And NOW we have to bribe her into realizing that maybe having the human take the fish food isn't a bad thing. Once we have that breakthrough, once we're not in that situation, training begins. But in the early stages even then it basically IS a bribe. You do what I want and I'll give you something you'll like.

I'm not saying that backing down from a growl is the right thing to do, cause if you want the dog to respect you then you damn well don't. Instead you SHOULD be pro-active to keep it from escalating in the first place. And if that involves a bribe to de-escalate then you do so, then figure out the training to keep it from happening again.

And yah, TMs don't care what you want. Apollo's very tightly bonded to me, and is fairly social tempered for a TM. He still doesn't really care what I want, he'll generally DO what I want, but only till it conflicts with what he views as more important (like, guarding me or the propertly). We mostly got through to him by showing him that being a jerk ment he got crated (or other wise seperated from what he felt needed guarding) and thus wouldn't be allowed to guard the house. Since he wants to guard he's learned manners.

Oh, TMmom, TM's are epic sulkers! Apollo has a thing for the cat toys (speaking of things you don't want your dog swallowing). He'll let me take them, and I always reward him for doing so, but he still sulks like I was a big meanie!

 

[Rugers-Kris]

What I am saying is that Resource guarding is NOT acceptable under any circumstances and that allowing your dog to growl at you or attempt to bite you is a bad idea. I am also saying that backing down and giving the dog that power is a horrible idea. I don't agree with bribing a dog because it sends the wrong message and actually promotes the behavior. I also would not live with a dog I couldn't trust but am more than willing to put the time and effort in to be able to do so.

Yes, of course we can agree to disagree. Otherwise, we'd have to arm wrestle over it.

But what you are saying in this thread is that people only have resource guarding issues or aggression issues because they haven't done the right things. This is unfair. It would be like me telling you that Ruger doesn't like the vet because he doesn't trust you. Because if you like the vet, and he trusts you, then he should like the vet.

I did the right things with my dog when she was young. I did them a lot because I could tell that she was going to have a harder temperament. I still would not trust her to not bite me if I pushed her. And because I know how TMs are, I'll never rely on her doing anything just because it's what I want her to do. No matter how much training I put into her, she'll never be that kind of dog.

Oh, and it's not like I disagree with what you are promoting. Early training to avoid these issues is very important. It's just that after owning a TM, I'm never going to assume that someone only has problems with their dog because they failed in some way.

I realize that. For future puppies or any other puppy owners that were reading, it needed to be said so I said it. Regardless of the age of this dog, it is a bad idea to back down and give an already untrustworthy animal that kind of power IMO. I am curious as to what you mean by "And if that involves a bribe to de-escalate then you do so, then figure out the training to keep it from happening again.". What "training" can you do to avoid it? If you are bribing this time to avoid, what will you do next time? If you bribe again then you aren't fixing the problem. I am very interested in what training you would suggest to avoid it in the future after the incident where you used bribery to handle it.
.

Because we're not discussing a 10week old puppy now. We're discussing a 9month old, well grown, teenager. What SHOULD have been done is a pretty moot point now except for future reference with a future pup. And NOW we have to bribe her into realizing that maybe having the human take the fish food isn't a bad thing. Once we have that breakthrough, once we're not in that situation, training begins. But in the early stages even then it basically IS a bribe. You do what I want and I'll give you something you'll like.

I'm not saying that backing down from a growl is the right thing to do, cause if you want the dog to respect you then you damn well don't. Instead you SHOULD be pro-active to keep it from escalating in the first place. And if that involves a bribe to de-escalate then you do so, then figure out the training to keep it from happening again.

And yah, TMs don't care what you want. Apollo's very tightly bonded to me, and is fairly social tempered for a TM. He still doesn't really care what I want, he'll generally DO what I want, but only till it conflicts with what he views as more important (like, guarding me or the propertly). We mostly got through to him by showing him that being a jerk ment he got crated (or other wise seperated from what he felt needed guarding) and thus wouldn't be allowed to guard the house. Since he wants to guard he's learned manners.

Oh, TMmom, TM's are epic sulkers! Apollo has a thing for the cat toys (speaking of things you don't want your dog swallowing). He'll let me take them, and I always reward him for doing so, but he still sulks like I was a big meanie!

 

[Rugers-Kris]

Broc, I also meant to point out that there is no comparison with the "I like the vet, Ruger should, too" as that is a whole different thing. MY point was that MY dog should trust ME to do anything to/for him (them). I like apples but Ruger doesn't...Magnum, however, will eat granny smith apples until he is sick given the chance. Ruger hates to take a bath, Magnum despises having his nails clipped but once a week they get both and ear cleaning and they don't fight me, they walk calmly to the shower as they are told and Magnum hangs his head in hope that I will be syympathetic and skip the nail but he sits calmly and lets me do it because they know it is going to happen and the respect and trust ME enough to do it. Directly after all of the grooming, they get special chews and they are thrilled to get them and as soon as the last nail is clipped and I say/sign "Good boy", they run to the cupboard tails wagging.

If One of them hurt themselves badly and were in pain and needed help they would let ME handle them and then I would take them to the vet and we could sedate if need be because they don't live at the vets office and hasn't bonded with him...there is no mutual trust or respect nor should there be, they live in MY home with ME.

 

[Hector]

Okay so...Hector is nervous of me because he is a nerve bag. I do not bias my dogs and I tell them as they are. I do tons of bonding/mental exercises, more than I can even describe. I put tons of effort in Hector and I rarely even try with Buddy. The problem with Hector is he is a nervous dog and there is nothing I can do to change that. I can manage his reactivity through managing the environment, through obedience, through reading him, but no one will ever be able to change how a dog is genetically wired.

In the situations as you described - poisonous frogs - I don't know how likely that is to happen, but if it were to, I would say my drop it command and if that doesn't work than I can care less about getting bitten and "try" to get it out of his mouth, but knowing my dog he'd probably drop it. He's gotten in garbage and taken off with fast food bags and all I say is drop it and he pathetically does it. I practice so much of this stuff to prepare for emergencies and hoping it will all pay off.

In the case of the child's arm. I do not know how this relates to resource guarding, but if this ever happened - say like bit the child - I would have him put down.

Sharp object, again I would say drop it very sternly and watch his reactions. I mean one that can read their dog can pretty much predict what is going to happen. A dog with a history of gulping things down when they see their owners approach or panic, then the dog will most likely swallow it before you can reach the dog. A dog with a history of dropping high items (or to the human it is high value to the dog) they will most likely drop it. Again that is why training and practice are so important. I would say a dead bird would be high value enough to a dog, but who knows, but I have tested Hector and he drops it on command - no problems. He sometimes he will come prancing into the living room with a can from the recycling like it's a prized possession, but when I say drop it, he does.

Have you ever dealt with a nervous dog or a dog that resource guards or even a dog that does not handle stress well? There are dogs that handle stress with aggression. Hector does and Buddy does not.

I am in no way teaching that I am backing off and letting him keep the item. I am simply approaching this a different way. In the end "I" still win.

In dogs, there are also different levels of rank drive and pack drive that come into play and others like defense drive and add in possessive traits with a weak nervous system = bad bad combo.

You can say it's a trust/bond/training issue, but I'm going to stick with bad nerves.

I don't want to post this video, but I will. This is how I choose to deal with things. I don't like to escalate things when it's not needed. Yes, you have asked well what if he doesn't listen? Well it has never gotten to that point so I don't really know to be honest, but if this was a matter of another person's safety - then I wouldn't even think twice about what to do.

I don't know if the vicinity of Bud triggered his reaction, but Hec doesn't like Bud close to him when I'm home. I'm going to say he was growling at me because he was looking at me and then he exploded at Bud. I verbally cued Bud to move back so the situation doesn't escalate. Then I cue Hector to leave the item and go in his crate (time out place).

[video=youtube_share;ve6HHqw1CSA]http://youtu.be/ve6HHqw1CSA[/video]

 

[Catia]

I am not sure how one would go about the situation with a dog 1 yr, as opposed to a puppy, as I have never been in that situation.

But for me, in learning about TM's guarding instinct, I upped 'mouth play' with Tessa as a pup. And I mean to such a level where it is part of our every day routine, just a fact of life-she's not known my hands not to be there.

Never a day goes by where I do not have my hands in her mouth-or food bowl, because I never want her to NOT give something back. When she was a pup & eating several times per day, this meant every feeding--several times per day. This also meant toys & treats.
There are times where I have to pry things from her mouth--dead birds, gross things she picks up on walks, ...cat toys...I do not trade up, I don't believe in it, but that being said, I never had to deal with the situation with a full grown dog of my own.
She will wait to eat, she will give up a treat, & the repetition has been life long daily for her, so she's never known any different.

 

[ruthcatrin]

I realize that. For future puppies or any other puppy owners that were reading, it needed to be said so I said it. Regardless of the age of this dog, it is a bad idea to back down and give an already untrustworthy animal that kind of power IMO. I am curious as to what you mean by "And if that involves a bribe to de-escalate then you do so, then figure out the training to keep it from happening again.". What "training" can you do to avoid it? If you are bribing this time to avoid, what will you do next time? If you bribe again then you aren't fixing the problem. I am very interested in what training you would suggest to avoid it in the future after the incident where you used bribery to handle it.
.

You train, or re-train if need be, a drop it, a leave it, and/or a give me command. A dog with a strong leave it and/or drop it isn't going to resource guard the item. And yah, that training requires rewards at least in the initial stages.

And you also sit down with the dog and, starting with low value items, show them that in a non-stressfull situation letting you take something from them results in good things (be it treats or praise or whatever works best for the dog). Then you work your way up to higher and higher value items, in non-stressfull non-frantic situations where no one's adrenaline is going and show the dog that even high value items don't need to be guarded cause good things happen when they let you take it.

Oh, and I gotta agree with Hector, if the dog is resource guarding a bite of human you have bigger problems than RGing to deal with....

 

[ruthcatrin]

I am not sure how one would go about the situation with a dog 1 yr, as opposed to a puppy, as I have never been in that situation.

But for me, in learning about TM's guarding instinct, I upped 'mouth play' with Tessa as a pup. And I mean to such a level where it is part of our every day routine, just a fact of life-she's not known my hands not to be there.

Never a day goes by where I do not have my hands in her mouth-or food bowl, because I never want her to NOT give something back. When she was a pup & eating several times per day, this meant every feeding--several times per day. This also meant toys & treats.
There are times where I have to pry things from her mouth--dead birds, gross things she picks up on walks, ...cat toys...I do not trade up, I don't believe in it, but that being said, I never had to deal with the situation with a full grown dog of my own.
She will wait to eat, she will give up a treat, & the repetition has been life long daily for her, so she's never known any different.

Tessa's not really a gulper though, except possibly with poop. If she were she'd have it swallowed and gone before you could get her mouth open and every time you tried you'd be reinforcing her gulping.

 

[cinnamon roll]

I could not of said it better myself Kris. I REFUSE to bribe my dog to give me something they are NOT supposed to have. Now if they give it to me when I ask then yes I will treat them. But if they want to "argue" about handing it over it is not gonna turn out in their favor. I am Alpha end of story no compromise.

This is going to be the unpopular comment but I am going to say it anyway. I believe in positive training and definitely use it BUT in my world, growling at me is totally unacceptable. My dogs are happy, healthy and well adjusted...they are also big spoiled brats that have received praise and positive training from the moment they came home but the first thing they were taught is that there is no acceptable reason to threaten me EVER. I can take anything I want from them anytime and I don't trade up. It is definitely a personal choice and I am sure there will be tons of comments about how wrong I am but I am just putting it out there as another view. In my opinion there are things that are totally non negotiable and this is one of them. I am all for a treat AFTER the dog gives up the "thing" but trading up is not rewarding her for doing the right thing but bribing her and personally I think that is setting her up for failure.

 

[BlackShadowCaneCorso]

In my house your growl at mama over anything and shit is about to get real!

 

[Rugers-Kris]

I guess I am having a hard time understanding his being a nervous dog having anything to do with a lack of trust towards you. I have to wonder if your lack of faith in him is what he is responding to. I can tell you that I personally would not allow a dog to live in my home and run it which is what it sounds like Hector is doing.

As for poisonous frogs they are actually not as uncommon as you might think. I think it was Fila4 me that had a friend that almost lost a Dogo recently because of one but thankfully after tons of medical care, the dog survived but it doesn't have to be so literal. It was just an example. I think it is great that you have the drop it command and leave it command down so well as they are a couple of the most important that a dog can learn IMO A childs arm relates in that, if he grabs a kid....Obviously you can't try several times with "leave it", you have to get in there and save a child...I should hope everyones answer to that question would be that they would risk the bite to save the child BUT if you had a dog that respected you .....You should be able to remove the dog without risking your own life. Yes, that example was a little extreme but in the end I believe and always have that your dog should trust you and respect and vice versa....I would NOT love with a dog that I didn't trust.

Yes, I have advocated for Pit Bulls since I was barely an adult and I raised them for years as well as worked with local humane societies to prove that these dogs were not only worthy of saving (They were putting them down left and right in Florida...Even puppies) but that they can be trustworthy, intelligent and dedicated dogs. Breeding them got out of control down here much like it did everywhere else and the humane society filled up and a lot of these dogs were resource guarding and fear aggressive for obvious reasons. They had been abused, been abandoned, neglected, nearly starved to death, etc so there is no way they could be expected to pass a temperament test a few days after they ended up in a shelter especially when the people conducting the test were scared of them so I donated some time to the humane society to work with Pits exclusively, working with them everyday.....walking them, hand feeding them and earning their trust. It was a very heart breaking but rewarding volunteer experience. Anyway, Yes I have worked with seriously nervous and aggressive dogs as well as those that would piss all over themselves and run away but never consider biting you. There are a thousand different ways to train and work with dogs and I don't believe my way is the only way but I have a line that I will not allow to be crossed. I believe don't bite the hand that feeds you and I will not tolerate that under any circumstances and I believe that you can be positive yet firm. I have two very happy, healthy and well adjusted dogs that speak for that. Regardless of the breed of dog........WE must be the leader and we must be able to trust our dogs and if we can't we are risking them, ourselves and others. Besides the fact that a constantly excitable dog (Nerves, anger, etc.) is not a happy dog so isn't it a huge disservice to them?

I appreciate you sharing that video, I am sure it wasn't easy for you. That is very scary. In my opinion, you are asking for trouble. He looks directly at you with the challenge and even steps toward you to show you that he is in charge as well as threatening the other dog. He gives in at the end but only because he doesn't mind.....Not because you are the leader. No doubt he cares about you since he is taking you into consideration and if it were a stranger he would probably just bite them but I don't see that he respects you and to me that is the scariest part of all. I am not meaning to offend you at all but if asked a question I can only be honest with my answer (Opinion). For your sake, I hope he continues to walk away from the things you want him to.

Okay so...Hector is nervous of me because he is a nerve bag. I do not bias my dogs and I tell them as they are. I do tons of bonding/mental exercises, more than I can even describe. I put tons of effort in Hector and I rarely even try with Buddy. The problem with Hector is he is a nervous dog and there is nothing I can do to change that. I can manage his reactivity through managing the environment, through obedience, through reading him, but no one will ever be able to change how a dog is genetically wired.

In the situations as you described - poisonous frogs - I don't know how likely that is to happen, but if it were to, I would say my drop it command and if that doesn't work than I can care less about getting bitten and "try" to get it out of his mouth, but knowing my dog he'd probably drop it. He's gotten in garbage and taken off with fast food bags and all I say is drop it and he pathetically does it. I practice so much of this stuff to prepare for emergencies and hoping it will all pay off.

In the case of the child's arm. I do not know how this relates to resource guarding, but if this ever happened - say like bit the child - I would have him put down.

Sharp object, again I would say drop it very sternly and watch his reactions. I mean one that can read their dog can pretty much predict what is going to happen. A dog with a history of gulping things down when they see their owners approach or panic, then the dog will most likely swallow it before you can reach the dog. A dog with a history of dropping high items (or to the human it is high value to the dog) they will most likely drop it. Again that is why training and practice are so important. I would say a dead bird would be high value enough to a dog, but who knows, but I have tested Hector and he drops it on command - no problems. He sometimes he will come prancing into the living room with a can from the recycling like it's a prized possession, but when I say drop it, he does.

Have you ever dealt with a nervous dog or a dog that resource guards or even a dog that does not handle stress well? There are dogs that handle stress with aggression. Hector does and Buddy does not.

I am in no way teaching that I am backing off and letting him keep the item. I am simply approaching this a different way. In the end "I" still win.

In dogs, there are also different levels of rank drive and pack drive that come into play and others like defense drive and add in possessive traits with a weak nervous system = bad bad combo.

You can say it's a trust/bond/training issue, but I'm going to stick with bad nerves.

I don't want to post this video, but I will. This is how I choose to deal with things. I don't like to escalate things when it's not needed. Yes, you have asked well what if he doesn't listen? Well it has never gotten to that point so I don't really know to be honest, but if this was a matter of another person's safety - then I wouldn't even think twice about what to do.

I don't know if the vicinity of Bud triggered his reaction, but Hec doesn't like Bud close to him when I'm home. I'm going to say he was growling at me because he was looking at me and then he exploded at Bud. I verbally cued Bud to move back so the situation doesn't escalate. Then I cue Hector to leave the item and go in his crate (time out place).

[video=youtube_share;ve6HHqw1CSA]http://youtu.be/ve6HHqw1CSA[/video]

 

[Rugers-Kris]

My typos are awful but I am jumping back and forth between work and the forum as I type so it is what it is. I think they aren't so bad that way I am saying isn't being conveyed.