Standing Ground.

[Esand]

My point wasn't to use the prong for corrections in that instance. It's just a better collar choice than a flat collar when it comes to when a dog tries to back out or pull out. Flat collars can choke and injure the dog. A prong doesn't choke and it puts equalized pressure around the neck and not localized like a flat or choke chain. Plus, it would give u better control.
And yes, your dog was threatened (Or else it wouldn't have felt the need to run) and it ended up injuring a dog and a human. Two things which could have been a lot worse and cost u a lot more. Secondly, no, it's not your dog's job to protect you. Sure, it's nice to think they will, but don't assume on it just because it's a "protection dog". Unless you've spent the money on protection training u don't have one. If u want it to be one plan on spending a lot of money to have it trained to be one.
So wether it helped or not (I just didn't tell u what u want to hear) is up to u. Hopefully you learned some lessons. We don't get better when things are sunshine and rainbows. We learn (or at least should) learn from our failures/mistakes.

Here's my take on prongs: I own one for my other current dog and I've used them with other previous dogs as well. I think they're great tools but in the particular situation is an example of their biggest problem. My goal is to build up confidence and to hopefully show her that no, this dog coming at us is not a threat, but with a prong as she would have pulled away in fear the collar would have closed and the prongs would have set showing her that this bounding dog (who is completely innocent and wasn't injured) is something worth fearing.

 

[Esand]

damn, I always want to edit....

anyway adding on to my previous post...

I really don't like the idea of prongs or e-collars (which I own as well) for puppies. They're a lot more impressionable at this age and the goal as a trainer/owner is to expose them to the world without prejudices, you need to build up their character at this stage, not crush it under the heel of your boot.

 

[season]

You have bigger issues then worrying about collars at this point. Socializing your dog isn't about playing with other dogs nicely or being friendly with ppl. So many ppl think that's what it's about. You want your dog to be indifferent. You want your dog to see everything as part of the environment. You want your dog to be engaged with you. Period. You build up your dog's confidence by doing work with it. Structured walks. Place command. Impulse control. Nose work. You also build your dog's confidence by being confident yourself and frankly you don't come off as confident in my opinion. You seem a tad wishy washy and indecisive. How u handled this situation shows that. Hector gave u some great advice. I'd take it.


"Today is victory over yourself of yesterday."
- Miyamoto Musashi

 

[season]

In your first response you said my advice wasn't helpful and that you or your dog weren't threatened. Now u say u were. That's wishy washy. Make up your mind. Don't take my advice or Hector's to get your head out of your ass. Apparently u didn't take her previous advice. Here's a good article about socializing. Hope it helps.
Leerburg | Socializing Puppies a Pushy Puppy


"Today is victory over yourself of yesterday."
- Miyamoto Musashi

 

[Esand]

In your first response you said my advice wasn't helpful and that you or your dog weren't threatened. Now u say u were. That's wishy washy. Make up your mind. Don't take my advice or Hector's to get your head out of your ass. Apparently u didn't take her previous advice. Here's a good article about socializing. Hope it helps.
Leerburg | Socializing Puppies a Pushy Puppy


"Today is victory over yourself of yesterday."
- Miyamoto Musashi

I stand by the fact that we weren't threatened and that I didn't feel threatened. That we weren't being threatened was quite clear to me as a rational human. It's also quite clear that she, not having the benefit of being a rational human, felt threatened.

The difference between perception and reality is what we need to work on.

 

[teodora]

I agree: the problem is aiming and going for a person's neck, and that's a damn BIG problem. I would be very very worried about human aggression if she was my dog. Unfortunately , our dogs have to adjust to living among humans without eating them up. I pretty much do the same: tight collar on, gentle leader collar which makes me able to handle him quickly and get him look at me, muzzle when off leash and there are people/dogs around. Plus I work with him (and hopefully with a new trainer) daily/with trainer for recall on a regular basis. I do my best to prevent it from happening - there's no "easy fix" and I would not penalize him for his protection instinct either. He's very young and gets winded up when he sees other male dogs (he won't start a fight but he'll stand his ground if given half a chance, and believe me, I wish he didn't....)

 

[angelbears]

You should never breed Filas. You are fucking clueless. You are making all kinds of excuses but the bottom line is, you let your dog get a bite when you shouldn't have. There is no excuse. You have been warned by many people that have years of experience with these dog and yet you ignore them. These dogs are banned in countries for a reason.

 

[season]

I've used a prong since the day I got my dog home. No issues. It's not the tool but the owners. You are spending a lot of time trying to figure out how to help your dog. Maybe the best way to do that is to help yourself. That would go a long way in helping your dog. As a wise Hector and angelbears said, "get your head out of your ass." How bout you quote their comments instead of mine? They can clear things up for u. Even though they have apparently already tried and choose not to listen. Anyway, good luck.


"Today is victory over yourself of yesterday."
- Miyamoto Musashi

 

[season]

You should never breed Filas. You are fucking clueless. You are making all kinds of excuses but the bottom line is, you let your dog get a bite when you shouldn't have. There is no excuse. You have been warned by many people that have years of experience with these dog and yet you ignore them. These dogs are banned in countries for a reason.

Thank you


"Today is victory over yourself of yesterday."
- Miyamoto Musashi

 

[Smokeycat]

I feel like there's been some confusion. I'm not upset with Leia for having bitten. Not at all, not in the slightest. If you go back to the first post in the thread I never once said anything to that effect.

I agree there is some confusion. I don't know where you live but most of the people active on the forum live in countries where a dog bite can easily result in the dog being euthanized. So people aren't upset that a fila bit someone, she was doing what she was bred to do. What upset me,and I believe others also, is that your biggest concern isn't the risk to her life but that she ran away. You have a baby that is already willing to take a killing bite. All the advice I've seen given by those who either have or had Filas seems to be directed towards making sure that she isn't placed in a position to risk being euthanized because she mauled or killed someone.

Sent from my SM-G920W8 using Tapatalk

 

[Esand]

You should never breed Filas. You are fucking clueless. You are making all kinds of excuses but the bottom line is, you let your dog get a bite when you shouldn't have. There is no excuse. You have been warned by many people that have years of experience with these dog and yet you ignore them. These dogs are banned in countries for a reason.

I'm not trying to excuse her biting, that wasn't the point of this thread, at all. You tried to make it an issue. It is completely not her fault that she bit the lab's owner, that is expected and understandable behavior. The unexpected was that she ran from the Lab. That's what this thread was about. I feel like something was lost in translation here.

 

[season]

It is an issue and frankly the only issue you should be worried about. The fact that you're more concerned at getting you dog with a bite history to stand it's ground. Don't u see how stupid that sounds? No it wasn't your dog's fault it was yours.


"Today is victory over yourself of yesterday."
- Miyamoto Musashi

 

[teodora]

It is completely not her fault that she bit the lab's owner, that is expected and understandable behavior.

Yours behaviour is not expected nor understandable. Do you know what kind of dog you have? If you do, then own it. I don't think she "ran away" I think she moved around evaluating the battlefield and finding the right angle and that's what my dog tends to do as well, they apply some kind of killing strategy and they don't always just run in straight line to the target. Again, that's not the point: the point is to do WHATEVER IT TAKES to prevent it or get your dog out of that situation, not in 20 seconds - in 2 seconds. Otherwise she'll end up dead and you in jail.

 

[season]

Yours behaviour is not expected nor understandable. Do you know what kind of dog you have? If you do, then own it. I don't think she "ran away" I think she moved around evaluating the battlefield and finding the right angle and that's what my dog tends to do as well, they apply some kind of killing strategy and they don't always just run in straight line to the target. Again, that's not the point: the point is to do WHATEVER IT TAKES to prevent it or get your dog out of that situation, not in 20 seconds - in 2 seconds. Otherwise she'll end up dead and you in jail.

Exactly. And if you're worried about a second of discomfort a prong will cause your dog it's a hell of a lot better than having your dog kill another dog or a human. Get a clue. Listen to these ppl and stop making excuses. Own your baggage.


"Today is victory over yourself of yesterday."
- Miyamoto Musashi

 

[Esand]

I agree there is some confusion. I don't know where you live but most of the people active on the forum live in countries where a dog bite can easily result in the dog being euthanized. So people aren't upset that a fila bit someone, she was doing what she was bred to do. What upset me,and I believe others also, is that your biggest concern isn't the risk to her life but that she ran away. You have a baby that is already willing to take a killing bite. All the advice I've seen given by those who either have or had Filas seems to be directed towards making sure that she isn't placed in a position to risk being euthanized because she mauled or killed someone.

First of all its a bit of an exageration to say killing bite she wouldn't have killed the man. At most she would have subdued him.

Also the man was not badly hurt, just startled and very apologetic about the behavior of his dog. I think this killing dogs thing must be an american phenomena (not surprising considering the incidence of capital punishment for humans). If after during a 10 day quarantine a dog who bit is found to be rabid then the dog can be euthanized. Otherwise no.

Still I don't think my concern made it across. I was concerned about her life as well, not only did the lab put his life at risk when he crossed a four lane 2 way avenue but if Leia hadn't ran straight down the sidewalk (for which I'll take a bit of credit) she could have easily been killed by a vehicle as well.

Running rather than standing her ground next to a busy street is a risk to her life. Don't assume that isn't a huge concern to me, and wasn't what flashed through my mind when she back out of her collar and took off running.

 

[Esand]

It is an issue and frankly the only issue you should be worried about. The fact that you're more concerned at getting you dog with a bite history to stand it's ground. Don't u see how stupid that sounds? No it wasn't your dog's fault it was yours.

Seriously, why am I not being understood? IT WAS NOT MY DOG'S FAULT. How is this not getting across???

 

[season]

I know it wasn't your dog's fault. It was yours. That what I said. Read. And stop trying to make excuses. Makes u sound even more delusional.


"Today is victory over yourself of yesterday."
- Miyamoto Musashi

 

[season]

And then u minimize the whole biting thing. Unreal. U don't get it.


"Today is victory over yourself of yesterday."
- Miyamoto Musashi

 

[Esand]

Yours behaviour is not expected nor understandable. Do you know what kind of dog you have? If you do, then own it. I don't think she "ran away" I think she moved around evaluating the battlefield and finding the right angle and that's what my dog tends to do as well, they apply some kind of killing strategy and they don't always just run in straight line to the target. Again, that's not the point: the point is to do WHATEVER IT TAKES to prevent it or get your dog out of that situation, not in 20 seconds - in 2 seconds. Otherwise she'll end up dead and you in jail.

I've been surrounded by dogs all my life, I know what scared/nervous looks like. I saw it last night. I see it at dog parks.

She didn't 'run away' because she did come back, but her coming back was her fight instinct beating her flight instinct which was what had won when the dog first approached.

 

[Esand]

I know it wasn't your dog's fault. It was yours. That what I said. Read. And stop trying to make excuses. Makes u sound even more delusional.


"Today is victory over yourself of yesterday."
- Miyamoto Musashi

I know you said that. I've also said that since the beginning. We're in agreement.