Raw, Vaccines, and to Crop or not to Crop?

[Mastinilover]

Oh the joys of the overly anxious mind of a soon to be new Neo owner. I'm still months away, but now that I know this is going to happen my mind has kicked into override! I'll apologize for the length now!

Raw :
I'd really like to feed a raw diet to the puppy when he gets here. My other two dogs eat high end kibble, but they'd be switched to raw as well. Them I'm not worried about, but I've heard conflicting information on feeding raw to puppies.

1. Do I still follow the 80/10/10 method with the 6-10% body weight (Also, what age would the 6-10% change to the 2-3% for adults)?
2.The breeder feeds 4 Health Puppy Formula (regular not large breed) should I stick with that until he's older or is switching to raw right away ok to do? I don't want to cause any growth problems.
3.I'd feed just chicken (backs and necks mostly) for the first 5 weeks then slowly start introducing more of a variety of meats and cuts, but what age is a good age to introduce organ meat? I've heard around 6 months is a good time to start?

Vaccines :

1. Some recommend for the larger breeds to follow a extended schedule for vaccinations. At what age did your pup/dog get their vaccines and how long did you wait between?
2. Is there any recommended brand that is safer for them than another brand would be?

Cropping :
I'm not sure if I want to crop the ears or not. I like how they look in both states.

1.Is there any added benefit to cropping than to leaving natural for this breed? (Ear infections, etc)
2.What made you choose to crop or leave "natural?"

You guys are going to hate me by the time I actually get my dog with all these long posts and multiple questions and I'm only on my third day of membership!! lol I just like to have all my information straight LONG before so I'm not in a panic situation and not knowing what to do. Please, do tell if I become bothersome

 

[Aplatitsin]

I have a corso with cropped ears
And about raw for mastiffs feed raw only when they are older than one year that's what I will be doing
And about vaccines I only got rabies parvo and distemper and Lyme all those other shots I think dogs just don't need then because later on pups can be sensitive in other ways to shots fell free to correct me and with the ear crop I've heard that some neos are sensitive to anesthesia but when the ears are cropped the ear is constantly ventilated so no ear infections I prefer cropped you can search the site about feeding raw , ear cropping and shots you will get a lot of info

 

[ruthcatrin]

Vaccines: Someone else just asked much the same set of questions, so to save me all the typing: http://www.mastiff-forum.com/showthread.php/5430-Puppy-shots?p=44457&viewfull=1#post44457

Raw: there's no reason why you can't start raw right away. I know of breeders who feed raw from the instant they start to wean the pups. You'll still want to go 80/10/10, and estimate 2-3% of the expected adult body weight for daily intake (keeping in mind that small pups may not be able to put away large meals and so often require several meals through out the day). Don't be afraid to adjust the quantity up or down as needed to keep the pup at appropriate body weight, its entirely possible you'll hit that 6-10% mark at some point, especially if the pup is active, but start at 2-3% of the adult body weight and work from there. You can't wait to long to intro organs, they NEED those vitamins that they get from the organs, especially as a growing pup. Start with chicken yes, but more than backs/necks there's not enough meat on them usually, and once they're tolerating that well with no diarrhea start working in organs in small amounts, then start adding in different kinds of meat.

Can't help with cropping, I deliberetly got a breed where cropping isn't expected or wanted.

 

[musicdeb]

I agree with ruthcatrin about start raw right away. I'd recommend starting organ meat, i.e, liver to the dogs in about 3 weeks after starting raw. I feed Titan chicken leg quarters, 1/2 a whole chicken, turkey drumsticks, turkey necks, chicken or beef livers (I have to bake for about 20 minutes on 350 because he will not eat them raw), steak, pork, and fish. If the dogs resist the chicken, I sear it for about 10 seconds on each side to get the juices going.

If you feed them organ meat too soon or too much without buffering it with raw meaty bone, they will have cannon butt.

Hope that helps...

When I started raw, I used a scale, did a weekly menu and had a chart to record every time he ate and how much he ate. I feed Titan twice a day, 2 lbs in morning and 1 lb in early evening. Now I can tell by sight how much to feed him. It does not have to be perfect 80/10/10.

 

[Juella]

My blue neo is 4.5 months old, you would have thought i had never owned a dog before!! as anxious as I was, I feed Duska Blue Buffalo 3x a day plus she gets some boiled chicken for lunch and raw elk hamburger or steak for dinner, I don't tell my son that my dog eats his elk steak!!! haha. As for the ears, hers are not cropped just my preference, they get a bit dirty inside once in a while but I just clean them with a tissue. Good luck I wouldn't trade my Duska for anything.

 

[Mastinilover]

*facepalm*
I don't know how I missed the puppy shot thread. I searched and everything!!

Thanks guys!! We have a local butcher, two meat processing facilities, and lots of hunters that are always giving away extras (since you can't pay them for it) so he'll have lots of variety as he gets older and its all locally raised and butchered. And I'll definitely implement the chart idea, and I already have a scale

The vaccines I'm not too worried about after reading the lovely link ruthcatrin posted. Wonderful information!

 

[Smart_Family]

Definitely get him off the 4Health and raw would be ideal. I really like Dr. Dodd's vaccine protocol for pups.

 

[ruthcatrin]

*facepalm*
I don't know how I missed the puppy shot thread. I searched and everything!!

's'ok, its easy to do, but I didn't feel like typing it all again right then...Wish I had such nice access to meat. I'm working on it, but there's no meat processors at all local....

Musicdeb's right in that an EXACT 80/10/10 is not required, a bit extra bone today, a bit less tomorrow, forgot the organs today, add a little extra organs for the next few days...the ideal is an 80/10/10 overall if that makes sense.

right above my post in the Puppy Shots thread is a link to Dr Dodds protocal that Smart Family posted, but if it helps my personal look on vaccines is based on it. I just tried to add in my justifications and thoughts on each individual vaccine to help make things an educated choice, plus when your vet gets on your case cause you're not vaccinating for X you can explain WHY you've made that decision, I got my vet to agree with me on several points.

 

[BlackShadowCaneCorso]

Oh the joys of the overly anxious mind of a soon to be new Neo owner. I'm still months away, but now that I know this is going to happen my mind has kicked into override! I'll apologize for the length now!

LOL! There is nothing wrong with being prepared

Raw :
I'd really like to feed a raw diet to the puppy when he gets here. My other two dogs eat high end kibble, but they'd be switched to raw as well. Them I'm not worried about, but I've heard conflicting information on feeding raw to puppies.

1. Do I still follow the 80/10/10 method with the 6-10% body weight (Also, what age would the 6-10% change to the 2-3% for adults)? We fed RAW to one of our puppies with an allergy and just broke it into 3 meals, then 2 meals at 6 mths and now we are feeding one meal a day. We still are feeding 6-10% to him as he is still growing at a 13 mths old. We didn't have any problem with him once starting it and we follow the 80/10/10 ratio with him regardless of age.

2.The breeder feeds 4 Health Puppy Formula (regular not large breed) should I stick with that until he's older or is switching to raw right away ok to do? I don't want to cause any growth problems. I don't think there is any problem to switch to RAW right away just start with a single protein and work up from there, giving his system some time to adjust but also make sure to check with your breeder that they have no issues with the puppy eating RAW so that it won't affect your contract.

3.I'd feed just chicken (backs and necks mostly) for the first 5 weeks then slowly start introducing more of a variety of meats and cuts, but what age is a good age to introduce organ meat? I've heard around 6 months is a good time to start? We started RAW at 6 mths so I don't know for sure what the best time is to introduce organs into the mix.

Vaccines :

1. Some recommend for the larger breeds to follow a extended schedule for vaccinations. At what age did your pup/dog get their vaccines and how long did you wait between? We follow the same schedule that you would follow for any dog and then booster at a year. After that we vaccinate every 3 to 5 years, unless we are heading somewhere that we know there are more active problems.

2. Is there any recommended brand that is safer for them than another brand would be?

Cropping :
I'm not sure if I want to crop the ears or not. I like how they look in both states.

1.Is there any added benefit to cropping than to leaving natural for this breed? (Ear infections, etc)
2.What made you choose to crop or leave "natural?" I prefer the cropped look but we also show and it is hard to champion a dog that has natural ears against those that don't. Also sometimes a crop can enhance a head that isn't great. I haven't noticed much difference in ear infections and such but we wipe everyone's out pretty often anyway.

You guys are going to hate me by the time I actually get my dog with all these long posts and multiple questions and I'm only on my third day of membership!! lol I just like to have all my information straight LONG before so I'm not in a panic situation and not knowing what to do. Please, do tell if I become bothersome

Never be afraid to ask... that's what we are here for to learn from each other

 

[Buddha's Dad]

Anyone have a reliable supplier where we can get the distemper/parvo only for just one vaccine shipped to my house? Going to vets around here trying to get it has made my blood pressure raise way to much arguing with them on why I just wanted those two. Then if they can get it, they want to charge a fortune because they have to administer it.

 

[angelbears]

Check with feed/ranch stores.

 

[ruthcatrin]

Check with feed/ranch stores.

This: farm supplys, feed stores, etc, or: scroll down to Nobivac Puppy-DPv

http://www.drsfostersmith.com/Product/Prod_Display.cfm?pcatid=1263

 

[DDBsR4Me]

Another forum I'm a member of is dogfoodchat.com They have ALOT of information on raw feeding, it might be helpful to you.

I feed kibble, so I'm not much help, but there's a lot of knowledgeable raw feeders on that board.

 

[allformyk9s]

I agree w/ the above on raw diet. Our CC started raw at 2 weeks of age & is now 5 months, he's done & is doing great

As for cropping, both our CC's are from rescue so we arent allowed to crop which is a ok b/c I wouldnt do it anyway as ours are just pets, no intentions of showing etc......I like their ears being natural.

GL with your new baby!!!

 

[Mastinilover]

Thank you all for the wonderful information! DDBsR4Me, the raw forum was a godsend! Answered so many questions for me.

We've decided to leave the ears natural. We like the look of both, but being that he wont be shown and just a pet he'll keep his ears.

Another thing came to mind. I know, ideally, that neutering shouldn't take place until they're at least a year old. But, what if the breeder isn't comfortable with this? (I'll obviously ask her about it lol) Would that be a deal breaker for you? If the breeder just would NOT budge and say no, you had to do it by this deadline, would you go elsewhere?

 

[ruthcatrin]

Discuss with the breeder, be willing to sign a binding 'no breeding' contract. From there...it would have to depend. Of the breeder WILL NOT budge, but you honestly believe she's doing so for the right reasons (even if you don't agree), and you understand that by neutering early (and ideally you really want to wait till they're closer to two yrs) you're possibly setting yourself up for joint and other medical issues later....and you still want that puppy......I donno, glad it wasn't a call I had to make. Apollo's breeder required a contract with NO neutering BEFORE 10 months, and no breeding till he's had his hips/elbows checked. Otherwise the decision to neuter or not was totally left up to us, and at 1.5yrs old I haven't yet regreted leaving him intact.

 

[ravendarat]

If I was buying a neo and they said that they had to be fixed at a certain age and that age was prior to 18 months, then I would walk away without even blinking. I have seen WAY more than enough information to make me believe that early neutering in a giant breed dog can cause serious problems and I don't wanna get a puppy, get attached to him, neuter him early, then end up having him develop serious health problems all because I signed a piece of paper I don't agree with. Not gonna happen. It was one of the first questions I asked my breeder when I started looking for a pup. BTW I think the choice of no crop is a good one. I think the dogs look so much better uncropped but that just me. Just make sure to keep those ears clean.

 

[Duetsche_Doggen]

Oh the joys of the overly anxious mind of a soon to be new Neo owner. I'm still months away, but now that I know this is going to happen my mind has kicked into override! I'll apologize for the length now!

Raw :
I'd really like to feed a raw diet to the puppy when he gets here. My other two dogs eat high end kibble, but they'd be switched to raw as well. Them I'm not worried about, but I've heard conflicting information on feeding raw to puppies.

1. Do I still follow the 80/10/10 method with the 6-10% body weight (Also, what age would the 6-10% change to the 2-3% for adults)?
2.The breeder feeds 4 Health Puppy Formula (regular not large breed) should I stick with that until he's older or is switching to raw right away ok to do? I don't want to cause any growth problems.
3.I'd feed just chicken (backs and necks mostly) for the first 5 weeks then slowly start introducing more of a variety of meats and cuts, but what age is a good age to introduce organ meat? I've heard around 6 months is a good time to start?

Vaccines :

1. Some recommend for the larger breeds to follow a extended schedule for vaccinations. At what age did your pup/dog get their vaccines and how long did you wait between?
2. Is there any recommended brand that is safer for them than another brand would be?

Cropping :
I'm not sure if I want to crop the ears or not. I like how they look in both states.

1.Is there any added benefit to cropping than to leaving natural for this breed? (Ear infections, etc)
2.What made you choose to crop or leave "natural?"

You guys are going to hate me by the time I actually get my dog with all these long posts and multiple questions and I'm only on my third day of membership!! lol I just like to have all my information straight LONG before so I'm not in a panic situation and not knowing what to do. Please, do tell if I become bothersome

Oh how exciting was looking at some photos last night, lol, the breed needs to get better.

I have a new pup and started feeding raw the day I got him. He adjusted with not problems. I started with chicken necks since they are smaller and "easier" to manage for the pup. He's been on chicken for about two weeks once he gets a little older I will start adding some new things from the same meat source to his diet.

I agree with smart about getting him off the 4-health nothing "healthy" about that lol.

I posted a question about puppy vaccines a few days ago, the first set he had a 6 weeks, then around 9 weeks I got the second set. However next time I will have titers done ( thanks Ruth!) to determine if he needs the third set. Again Ruth provided the link with to the thread I started with all the information.

Cropping is a personal prefference, I have GM's Thor was 8 months when I got him thus too old for cropping. The little I still have a chance to but I opted out. When I had cropped I didn't notice any real difference as far as health both got dirty ears just the same. Although the crop was "easier" to clean, lol.

Questions are a great thing you can never ask too many!

 

[Mastinilover]

Thank you all! I'm feeling much better about all the things that have been weighing on my mind.
I'm not really a puppy person (meaning I've always gotten my dogs when they were older with an exception of a few, and have only had to deal with puppies through our rescue) so this is all quite new to me