Guess Tessa's Mix-Awaiting DNA test results

[raechiemay]

The more I see her & compare her to the pics posted here of a Gordon setter, the more I am starting to change my mind with my original guess. There's gotta be some Gordon in there. Then possibly rottie & TM.

When do you get the results back?! I'm anxious!

 

[kbuchanan66]

Are Gordon setters popular in your area? Where I am from they aren't.

 

[ruthcatrin]

Hm, more or less common that TMs?

I still think, just based on her temperment that Tessa's got either TM, or one of the other serious working line LGBs fairly close up in her background. But I do have to admit her head profile does look kinda setter-ish.

 

[raechiemay]

I've seen 1 Gordon in the 9 years I worked in the vet field so I'd say they aren't common in my area.

 

[Catia]

TMa are rare, period. Gordons, from what i gather aren't exactly rare, just not popular in city or suburbia, but backwoods & rural area's have them for hunting & pets.

Ya, I'm stumped, but I do see both TM & gordon setter. That would be a neat mix.
Her markings on her face & paws have the colors of TM's I see with that silveryblue & fawn coloring. Her colors really stand out, especially in the daylight, she's pointed and has those himilayan cat colors, whereas Gordon's are black & tan to black & mahogany. I get comments constantly about her colors, my pics don't capture it well. The ears are all wrong for a setter, but seem right for a TM. I think her weight at this point, is close to 60lbs means something bigger than gordon is mixed in.

Paws & vet thoughts:
My vet is convinced she's gonna be 120lbs easily...because of the size of her paws & thickness of her (front)legs, but he's not looking at her hind legs. I on the other hand strongly disagreed with him, because I've had dogs over 100lbs, & while Tessa's front paws & legs are nice & thick, her back feet are not as big or thick. I believe she will be more petite of a pooch, between 80-90lbs--maybe 100 tops when all filled out.
This is from my dog owning experience lol, *nothing scientific*. Tessa's rear paws measure about 9-10 inches from "heel to toe" while my last girls were 12-13inches "heel to toe" & at her heaviest she was 110lbs. I just don't see Tessa being a big girl, meaning over 100lbs.

Coat:
Tessa's fur was definately clippered as a pup, so the fluff in the puppy pics was not all of the fluff she actually had.
Her puppy body fur was VERY thick & like lambs wool-Her head fur was different & I've never felt anything like her head fur on a dog or puppy-it was softer than rabbit fur, but long & fluffy & thick, not wooley like the rest of her.
Her wooley pup fur-you couldn't get to the skin easily when bathing her you had to soak her & soap her up & really work at getting her all the way wet to the skin.
She blew that wooley fluff. I'm getting a super soft coat that seems to be wavy on her back & tail & is getting longer.
Fur is almost silky like fur, a lot of it but seems fine in texture. I am not noticing an undercoat of any kind (yet). It is fur, not hair, much softer than rottie or lab fur, & while it is abundant, you can easily get to her skin & on legs & underside, you can see her skin pretty easily.

Also, I am not noticing that oily type of coating on her fur or skin that rotties/shepherds & labs get--she also doesn't get a doggie smell, even when wet, her smell is slight & pleasant.
I don't know if any of this matters or if it is diet/food related. (Tessa is on Orijen LBP)
I just mention this cuz it might mean something. I've been petting other people's pooches, labs, rotties, shepherds, & I get that oily residue on my fingers after I give them a good rub & my hand will smell like 'dog', like doggie sebum or dandruff or whatever it is.
Tessa doesn't have that at all-no matter how much I give her rubs-my hands never smell like dog & I don't get any residue.

Temperament & Behavior:
This is how it all began LOL--the biggest mystery. Tessa just beats to her own drum & is unlike any pooch I have ever experienced. Flat worried the bejezus outta me for the 1st couple of months. She had very few puppy like behaviors & came like an 'old soul', didn't play much, little interest in toys, no puppy boisterousness--She was very quiet & serious & mellow. Zoomies are a rarity. I can count on 1 hand the amount of times she's even had them, & 2 of them were in the past week & constantly doing this 'observing' thing.

I hope her mellowness & low reactivity is her true temperament & not a fluke & stays this way.
While Tessa's lack of reaction & subtleness & low response stressed me out with worry, as far as normal puppy behavior goes,
I love how she behaves when I have her out, & that's daily, & I like that she's very predictible, it feels sometimes like she just was born 'pre-trained'. I'm still too nervous to trust it thoroughly though, it *really* is that odd of a mellow/evenness!!! There are mellow pups, my last pooch was a mellow pup & people experience that, but that's not what I'm talking about with Tessa, she's got something else going on.


Some of Tessa's whiskers got clippered too, & that's a VERYslow process in coming back. Some of the clippered ones have now fallen out & she's getting normal whiskers now.

 

[ruthcatrin]

I will say that Apollo's head is STILL one of the softest things ever (fur wise) and traditionally TMs have little to no doggy oder. Apollo certinally doesn't and never has. Nor does he have an oily coat. I've never been around a Gordon though so I can't compare.

 

[Smokeycat]

I have no experience with Gordon Setters but my Irish Setter mix has no doggy odor and I've never noticed his coat being oily other when I was having trouble finding a food that worked for him when he was a puppy. His coat also changed drastically from when I got him at 6 weeks until he reached 2 years, going from very short to long and feathery.

 

[Catia]

I've learned what colored eyebrows on my pooch are called: "eybrow pips"--who knew???
Now you know!

I was calling it Tessa's "reverse Grouch Marx", but "eyebrow pips" is cool too.

Tessa is growing so fast & I swear her fur is changing almost daily.
I wonder how long it is going to get.
Today, aside from the slight wave, she's got an entire back full of cow licks!!!
Or I guess they are "dog-licks" on a dog lol

So what is this???

She looks like someone brushed her against her fur against the way it grows & hair sprayed it & made it stay that way.
I thought it was because she went swimming last night & slept on it damp-so I thought nothing of it this morning
-but nope--after wetting it & trying to smooth it--it's cowlicks all over!!!

How does that even happen? Not curls, just sticking up cow licks, less wave now-& it's like theres a feathery like pattern to it.
What dog has that??? What is it even called???

It just stands up & it gives her GHETTO BOOTY.
My muppett has a ba-donka-donk !!!

Because I am a complete dork, I've been reading about dog color genetics.

Apparently, in order for any pooch to have "tan points", they must have 2 copies of the pointed gene, 1 from each parent, because it is recessive.
(specifically it is recessive Agouti).

So, regardless of the depth of color expressed (due to modifiers) in her tan points, she has them because both parents must carry the gene for tan points. So that narrows down some of the looking to pointed only pooches for what she is actually expressing.

Now of couse, genetics being what they are, that doesn't mean her parents have to be pointed, just means they have to carry the gene. A pooch can carry the gene & not be pointed if it has only 1 copy from 1 parent.(and to make it more confusing, points can be concealed, but no need to go there for Tessa-her points are definately expressed)

Since i read that , & gave my quickie version, here's a link that explains it nicely with pics--even a TM with some of his points hidden for an example.
http://www.doggenetics.co.uk/tan.html

A closer analysis of her face fur & I can see the bands of color on each hair--some are pointed red/tan/fawn, some pointed silver/blue.
Neat stuff to know, if you're a dork like me

 

[ruthcatrin]

Apollo still gets mohawks if I let him air dry, its quite funny!

And yes, black and tan is recessive, so she'd have had to have gotten that gene from both parents. Which may or may not narrow down the options lol.

 

[ruthcatrin]

And yah, black mask can hide the facial markings.

Heres a quick article on coat color genetics specific to the TM: Tibetan Mastiff Information, Tibetan Mastiffs, Tibetan Mastiff Breeders,Tibetan Mastiff Puppies, Tibetan Mastiff Pictures, Photos, Tibetan Mastiff Info.com. Or mostly anyway, no one can explain the solid whites yet!

 

[Smokeycat]

Tessa is growing so fast & I swear her fur is changing almost daily.
I wonder how long it is going to get.
Today, aside from the slight wave, she's got an entire back full of cow licks!!!
Or I guess they are "dog-licks" on a dog lol

So what is this???

She looks like someone brushed her against her fur against the way it grows & hair sprayed it & made it stay that way.
I thought it was because she went swimming last night & slept on it damp-so I thought nothing of it this morning
-but nope--after wetting it & trying to smooth it--it's cowlicks all over!!!

How does that even happen? Not curls, just sticking up cow licks, less wave now-& it's like theres a feathery like pattern to it.
What dog has that??? What is it even called???

Jiggers went thru a stage where his fur was like that. Actually I think there might have been two stages. Here's a picture that shows what he looked like at 9 months. Thickest area of the cow licks was on his neck and base of his spine but they were present all over his body. Every time he got wet more of them would appear until the fur got long enough to fall down under its own weight. The strands are also very fine and feathery.
These 2 photos were taken at 7 months. The first was pre-bath. The second was post-bath the same day. There was no sign of the cow licks before that bath.

 

[Catia]

Thanks Smokeycat--so my theory of "add water & fur grows" is somewhat true LOL.

I'll get a pic after work of her cowlicks. They are all on her back, the rest of her is smooth. Her hind leg & bum fur is looking longer.
It occurred to me this morning that maybe she needs a bath, the river water might have made it that way due to the silt, she doesn't seem to have as much sheen. Lake water didn't do that, but maybe river water does.

Tessa had a big day saturday, she went swimming, then to the dog park, but the dog park had a huge mud hole & all of the pooches layed down in it...cuz once one goes & gets told "no!"--the rest MUST follow!!!!

We got lucky with great dog owners, there were 2 labs. So we all went back down to the river to clean off the mud & they swam together & it was the coolest thing with all 3 of them swimming, much better than the dog park.

Funny thing--Tessa won't fetch/retrieve with other pooches at the dog park--but at the river--she's all about it. She totally comes alive in the water even with the other dogs.
Of course I let her bring home some driftwood & my floor is covered with it

 

[Smokeycat]

If she does have setter in her the fur on the backs of her legs, tail, chest and ears could get longer. Jiggers has very full feathering on his hind legs, tail and neck, fuller than a purebred Irish Setter but I think that is conning from the Golden Retriever side.

 

[Catia]

Here's what Tessa's coat is currently doing, some pics are dry, some wet.

Not sure if it is a heat issue or not, but even after a couple of hours swimming, Tessa still has energy. I'm thinking because she is staying cool. Usually I have to try to engage her, not so with swimming. Fetch in the yard, she's good for about 15 min & loses interest or gets tired.

Also, had a scare for a minute, she just kept swimming 1/2 way out into the lake last night, like she wanted to get to the other side! she came back once she hear a couple of whistles, but they echoed, lol thought I was going to have to jump in myself. Can't wait til I can swim with her!!! She loves to chase dragonflies & they seem to tease her-

 

[ruthcatrin]

I love her face.

 

[ruthcatrin]

I have to add, 60lbs at 6 months is compariable to Apollo in size. At 25 weeks old he was 68lbs. TMs are SLOW to reach their mature weight. Apollo was 118 at a couple months past his 2nd birthday and we expect him to get quite a big bigger still, he's not filled out hardly AT ALL. So if she is part TM I'd say that 120lb prediction might not be as far off as you're thinking.

I've got a couple pictures of Apollo at about 7 months that clearly show his feet and legs if you want a comparison.

 

[Catia]

sorry loaded some of the wrong pics & can't edit now.
let's try again!

 

[Mooshi's Mummy]

Gosh she is pretty!

 

[Smokeycat]

That picture of her back looks just like Jiggers did both times his coat started to grow out in length, except he was red. The more you describe her coat, the more I feel that she has setter in her to some degree.

 

[Catia]

yes, post comparison pics!!! Tessa is now 6 months, so somewhere in that age range.

If you have some wet pics that'd be great--she looks so skinny wet, but when she dries she looks like she's almost fat with this new fur thing going on.

Not sure what I see anymore, dry I do still see some TM-ish looks, wet though I see setter, I have no idea about her bone structure-the wet pics show it best-Not sure what I should be looking for or comparing to for her head & nose & jowls--thoughts?