Awright, Starting to Doubt (Pic Heavy)

[mountainfila]

This is probably were he came from, he looks similar to them, if he is fila then he got the shitty end of the genetic stick

Hoobly: Rare Breed Guardian Protection Fila Brasilerio

Do you have a full body standing side shot outside, its hard to tell from inside sitting down shots, i see some fila in him but other shots seem to have something else mixed in, his ear shape and length and his muzzle seems a bit pointy in the one shot and then he sorta looks like a fila in the shot of him looking at the food lady lol

 

[Winterspring]

HA! Not a chance. He can't stand still. I mean, I have some shots like that, but they're all blurry because he's a perpetual puppy motion machine.

And YES. I think that's EXACTLY where she got him! I can't imagine too many other Fila breeders in Mesa, which is where she said she got him. He has that fawn one's head and some of those dogs look just like him.

His personality is so Fila it's almost textbook, so I had to wonder. I thought he was just cruddily bred, and that makes much more sense now. The dam and the sire are supposed to have been brought straight from Brazil, but the variation there among the dogs on the slide show is so vast, that one dog looked like a Rhodesian Ridgeback cross. His ear shape is correct, but they're way too short. And from the pictures there, his body shape is much more Fila-y than some of those. Less heavy, more agile. (And BOY is that dog agile. We have a gate across the doorway to the sitting room. I think he just stays behind the thing as a courtesy.)

He's a Fila, alright, then. Just a lousy one. Great dog. Love him to bits. Just not exactly breedin' material, to put it nicely. To be honest, I thought he was mixed with Lab, too. Almost made me pass him up. She assured me he was pure Brazilian Mastiff (had no idea what that was...thought she was full of crap), so I went to look at him, looked in those big, yellow eyes and it was like everything fell into place. Now we have a dog that is shockingly protective when it comes to others, but wouldn't dream of hurting me (on purpose) for anything. (That tail is deadly. I'm pretty sure that the back end is more dangerous than the front, or so it seems from the bruises on the backs of my legs...ow.) He's also a parvo survivor. So I definitely think I got myself a pretty special boy, here. ^_^

 

[mr. tybs]

He's a handsome dog, and knowing his breed is good so you know what to expect, but in the end he your dog and knowing HIM is what matters.

 

[dogman#1]

like others pointed out in some pics he looks labish.... IF he is a fila he has to be one of the worst examples of the breed... now this doesnt mean that he isnt at least part fila or that he isnt a great dog.. some of the best dogs I have ever owned were mutts and/or rescues of the poorest examples of "purebreds" one has ever seen.Its awesome that someone that loves him, got him... parvo isnt something that many dogs get over fully.. you do have a very special boy there, a fighter for sure. good luck with him

 

[Winterspring]

Thanks. I'm proud of him. There's usually no doubt that he's a Mastiff when we're out. His body seems to be very Fila. Just seems to be his head. And, poorly bred, so very shortly after his second birthday..SNIP. He's apparently already sired an illicit litter on his previous owner's Husky (Fila/Huskies?? Kinda curious as to what THAT looks like...). His attitude seems to match, though. And one or two people have I.D.'d him as a Fila when I'm out and about with him. A few have said Lab mix, but the ones that I.D.'d him as a Fila were not from the States. "He is Fila? Is good boy." They knew to stay away from him. (I live in a very heavily Mexican/South American area in Phoenix.) And as you can see from the Mesa pictures, that guy's dogs don't seem particularly well-bred. There's one there that looks exactly like Taurus from the front, save for the length of his ears, so maybe I'm just a lousy photographer. He never seems to come out looking like he looks. :/ Or maybe he's just not photogenic? Eh.

But yeah, in the end, he's my dog, and since I'm not breeding him and there are so many traits I've seen in him that correlate to what the breed is like, I'm gonna treat him like a Fila and not take any chances. On the other hand, because of lousy breeding and that weird, vaguely Labbish look, I can probably pass him off as a mix, thus avoiding uncomfortable questions from potential landlords and such.

The general feel of all your answers is, "He's a beautiful doggy. Who cares? Don't breed him, and give him cookies." And so I shall.

 

[ruthcatrin]

The general feel of all your answers is, "He's a beautiful doggy. Who cares? Don't breed him, and give him cookies." And so I shall.

That mostly sums it up! He's handsome, he loves you, you love him. You understand not to breed him, and that he is and will be a ton of work. Thats the important parts!

 

[Winterspring]

Like mountainfila said, the guy in Mesa did NOT have great examples of the breed. "Straight from Brazil" my Aunt Fanny. The pic of the dog in the car looks JUST like Taurus except for the ears being too short on mine, and the bitch had a Rhodesian Ridgeback head.

Hm. Time to do some photoshopping.

At this point, I'm just curious.

Flippin' backyard breeders. At least they'd make lousy fighting dogs. They pack too well from what I've seen (JUST from the pictures of you nutters with like, five hundred Filas in the backseat! ) and photos on the 'net.

 

[dogman#1]

There comes a time when you have to figure that the "examples" of the breed that they have are just so bad that you have to consider the obvious.... perhaps they just arent pure? alot of people seem to go the route that theirs is just not a show quality dog and that is why it looks different than the others in the breed or that it is just a different bloodline... This just isnt the case in many cases. Those dogs can very well be from Brazil but that doesnt mean that they are purebred Filas Brasileiros... it is the reason why CAFIB was established as that is where the mixed breeding began and continues most. It is my opinion that MOST non CAFIB breeders h ere in the U.S. do not continue to mixed breed however that does not negate the fact that the dogs they brought in initially were already of mixed bred blood. breeding those dogs back to each other throughout the years does not make them any closer to a pure Fila Brasileiro than their parents were or their parents before them.

 

[Winterspring]

Nope. I no longer doubt. His personality matches perfectly, and it's only his head that's incorrect. Everything else is right. Camel pacing, swishy walk, headstrong but extremely smart, the sub-par eyesight others have mentioned, that tail is perfect, and he gets between me and anything he perceives as a threat. And as he gets older, the temperament is coming out more and more.

I doubt they could be papered by any organization if the lines weren't purebred. I take a bit of exception to the statement that he's one of "the worst examples" of the breed, since it's only his head that isn't perfect, and I've seen photos Filas that darn near look like Plott hounds. I've seen photos of long snouts, short snouts, short ears, long ears, narrow and broad faces. There's no more doubt in my mind.

I'm a proud Fila owner.

 

[dogman#1]

"I doubt they could be papered by any organization if the lines weren't purebred."

.... CBKC or any other FCI registry will paper a dog without verifying if the dog is pure or not... AKC, CKC, UKC all do it as well. The papers are only as good as the breeder producing the information... who was the breeder again? There should be nothing but doubt in your mind especially if his head is that incorrect. I guess it doesnt really matter though because you just know it with your trained and experienced eyes.

 

[mountainfila]

You forgot to mention cafib passes dogs with no paper work, look at the variation's that are being given a pass, like you said yourself that a few old school breeders in brazil do not reg their filas, so it just becomes hear say. By variations i mean the dog i seen on canis mortis page, a brindle bitch with a litter, her head is anything but "typical" cafib and she is passed as cafib reg, as he says on his page. And are you also saying that all litters have perfect puppies with no faults at all?

 

[cinnamon roll]

He is yours love him. He loves you. You know what breed you are dealing with. End of story!!! BTW I think he is handsome not every dog is gonna be perfect example of the breed. JMO

 

[dogman#1]

Nope, never said that... common misconception that CAFIB Filas are perfect... Pure bred and perfect are 2 completely different things, hell pure bred and good dont nec. happen all the time. That isnt what CAFIB is all about... Even if a dog is deemed pure and given an initial registration doesnt mean that it should be bred.. unlike CBKC papers, CAFIB papers actually tell you what the judge thinks about your dog... it will go into movement, skin, angulations, head, tail, toes, legs, temperament, ojeriza, etc, etc... at the end it will say approved with restrictions or without... most are with some sort of restriction, ie, must be bred with a more typical male or must be bred with a female with "Muito bom" temperament/nervous system/ojeriza/ etc. some have no restrictions other have severe restrictions in which the dog should not be bred, others can be disqualified from breeding due to number of faults others disqualified due to mixed breeding. If one follows the CAFIB judge then you will eventually get better dogs, if you dont then you might not and then those pups have to go in front of the judge as well and be judged... papers mean crap! The reason papers dont mean anything is because say I owned a champion but he cant breed anymore due to age or something... I want to sell pups....guess whose name goes on that paper????? We all know that dog cant breed but here goes this pup...lets say I buy that puppy and everyone can tell it is not from the parents that the papers say... according to your way of thinking he is a champion sired pup no matter what just because he has papers...... Like I said, papers are only as good as the people filling them out... there are just way too many "bad examples" that are obviously mixed bred in this breed that "must be pure because they have papers"...Hell Bubba do eshabetta must be pure, he has papers..... the truth is we all know he isnt, only a fool would believe his pedigree.

 

[tojvan]

Nope, never said that... common misconception that CAFIB Filas are perfect... Pure bred and perfect are 2 completely different things, hell pure bred and good dont nec. happen all the time. That isnt what CAFIB is all about... Even if a dog is deemed pure and given an initial registration doesnt mean that it should be bred.. unlike CBKC papers, CAFIB papers actually tell you what the judge thinks about your dog... it will go into movement, skin, angulations, head, tail, toes, legs, temperament, ojeriza, etc, etc... at the end it will say approved with restrictions or without... most are with some sort of restriction, ie, must be bred with a more typical male or must be bred with a female with "Muito bom" temperament/nervous system/ojeriza/ etc. some have no restrictions other have severe restrictions in which the dog should not be bred, others can be disqualified from breeding due to number of faults others disqualified due to mixed breeding. If one follows the CAFIB judge then you will eventually get better dogs, if you dont then you might not and then those pups have to go in front of the judge as well and be judged... papers mean crap! The reason papers dont mean anything is because say I owned a champion but he cant breed anymore due to age or something... I want to sell pups....guess whose name goes on that paper????? We all know that dog cant breed but here goes this pup...lets say I buy that puppy and everyone can tell it is not from the parents that the papers say... according to your way of thinking he is a champion sired pup no matter what just because he has papers...... Like I said, papers are only as good as the people filling them out... there are just way too many "bad examples" that are obviously mixed bred in this breed that "must be pure because they have papers"...Hell Bubba do eshabetta must be pure, he has papers..... the truth is we all know he isnt, only a fool would believe his pedigree.

BUBBBAAAAAAAAA YEAAAAAAAA LOL i love that name puts a smile on my face every time. All jokes aside you know sully i think hes owned by your sister, read it somewhere not sure don't quote me on it. I'm pretty sure he's CAFIB approved read that somewhere too. The question is, is he approved with restriction or without?

 

[dogman#1]

My sister? lol. His owner is a friend, cool people... Ask her, she is on here. I'd be surprised if there were no restrictions, not because he is a bad dog (he isnt) but because so few dogs ever get no restriction. Most people get their dogs tested as soon as they can so around 1 yr old and they usually dont do as well as a mentally and physically mature adult so Ive mostly seen restrictions based on temp (usually a confidence issue as they are young and never seen that before) or body type... mature adults get that really good bottom line and it looks very nice and their heads are finally fully developed.. the smart people do it later when their dog is like 3... Us in the U.S throw everything we got in the show, lol. So anyway if the head was underdeveloped it would state should be bred with bitch with strong head, it may or may not go into a specific detail in the head, ie, shorter, longer,wider,narrower muzzle better ear set, more pear shaped, etc, etc.. like I said it would be very difficult to get one with no restrictions as they all have something that can be improved on.

 

[mountainfila]

What ever happen to Sullys sister , was she ever evaluated and do you have any pics of her? She was a nice looking pup like her brother.

 

[dogman#1]

yea, I posted some pics of her before. She had her eval done although I dont remember if she was a year old when she was there... It doesnt matter, she didnt turn out in my eyes, not for breeding anyways. she is a pet.

 

[tojvan]

What ever happen to Sullys sister , was she ever evaluated and do you have any pics of her? She was a nice looking pup like her brother.

Mountain can you post an update on your pack with pictures and stuff of the pups. I'm looking forward to how Karl is looking now. He's probably around 10 months now.

 

[dogman#1]

here are the last pics I posted... she lives with my cousin about 10 mins away but every time I go there I havent taken any new pics.. harass me about it so I can remember to take my camera over there when i go.. this were her older ones. http://www.mastiff-forum.com/showthread.php/1652-Another-Fila-Brasileiro?highlight=lidia

 

[tojvan]

What ever happen to Sullys sister , was she ever evaluated and do you have any pics of her? She was a nice looking pup like her brother.

Mountain can you post an update on your pack with pictures and stuff of the pups. I'm looking forward to how Karl is looking now. He's probably around 10 months now.