Muzzles and Other Equipment

[Winterspring]

Okay. So I have my first vet appointment with Taurus on Saturday. He is accustomed to wearing a head collar and having stuff wrapped around his face for a minute or two while we play. I know it's not the same thing, but it should make wearing an actual muzzle easier since he doesn't mind when his face or head is messed with. (The doggie towel-turban on bath day is a hoot.) So. Training him to wear one shouldn't be too terribly difficult.

One teensy problem when ordering a muzzle.

How the hell do I measure him? Yes, I understand that I measure from one part to the next, and around the widest part of the snoot, but what about all that extra skin? And the Dewlap? How do I account for the flews? Especially since I detest the basket muzzles. I assume I leave about a finger or two's worth of space under the straps for comfort, but all that extra skin confuses me. (Cat = take collar from package, put collar on cat. Annoy cat. Let cat go.)

This goes for collars, too. Where should the collar sit on a Fila or any other loose-skinned dog? How much room should be allowed for the extra skin? He seems pretty comfy in his cheap-o collar right now, but I'm not entirely sure it's the best for him. (Again, I grew up doing a lot of stuff with horses, and leather has always been my preference for larger animals. Sturdy and easy to clean, nice look and easy to fit.)

I understand that padding is pretty much a MUST, and I want him to be able to vocalize (including a warning growl), drink, accept treats when he's behaving, so I like the muzzles that are bands around the face with straps attaching it to the head.

Also...halters. Should I put the collar on with the muzzle AND the halter? I kind of thought as much, because of tags. And yes, I realize that Taurus will look like some SCA-refugee war dog. (Nothing wrong with that, of course.)

Again. Thank you for all your help.

 

[ruthcatrin]

Why do you detest basket muzzles? They are by far the safest type for the dog.

 

[ruthcatrin]

a video explaining how to measure for a muzzle: http://www.dtdogcollars.com/Sizing-Instructions-for-Muzzles-Harness-Collars-Leashes-s/192.htm also, on this page, scroll down below the video for a visual explanation: DT Muzzle

Note, although Dean and Tyler produces great products, and quite a few other folks have bought stuff from them and been happy with it, I don't recommend them as the one time I tried to order stuff from them it turned into a nightmare. But they have some of the best instructions for measureing for a muzzle.

 

[filagiel]

An Xlarge nylon fits a fila and I haven't had a problem with it. I have to muzzle one of my females for vet appointments. I've never used a basket muzzle but they do look like the safest.

 

[ruthcatrin]

I had to go find the link, but MusicDeb ordered one from here for her DDB and last I paid attention still liked it: Mastiff harness, Mastiff muzzle, Mastiff collar, Dog leash, Dog Lead

 

[LizB]

My dane gets the XL nylon for the vet for a rectal tumor that he just won't tolerate her fooling with. It fits him perfectly, but he cannot pant and gets extremely worked up because of that. It holds his mouth completely shut. I would much prefer the basket style so he can open his mouth a little.

 

[Winterspring]

I like to have access to his nose and mouth, even if he can't open it wide enough to nip. He likes to touch with his nose when he needs comfort, and prefers to be able to get his nose directly on the ground for a good sniff. Also, he likes to bunt, and with the basket on, it's like being bunted by a bull elephant. As opposed to the baby-elephant-bunt I normally get.

Thank you for the link!

 

[ruthcatrin]

some muzzles have wider spaced wire, which would allow you to get a finger or two in to touch his nose, but for the bunting you'd have to teach him not to when he's wearing a muzzle....

 

[Winterspring]

An "occlusion" muzzle is the type that I liked to keep him from snapping while allowing him his comfort. He's a weirdly tactile dog.

 

[ruthcatrin]

The problem with them is that the dog can't pant, so you couldn't put the muzzle on at home and then transport to the vets office, and I don't know that I'd even be comfortable putting it on and then sitting in the waiting room for an extended period of time with it on. And if you wait till you're at the vets, or even till you're in the exam room, its going to be a much more stressfull process to put the muzzle on the dog (and he may associate the muzzle with the vet, which you really don't want).

You might consider one of the leather basket muzzles instead, he could smush it to the ground for scenting, and its not going to hurt as much if he bunts, but it would still allow him to pant properly. You'd have to be extra sure it fit properly though, as he could potentially tear it off if it didn't.

 

[CeeCee]

I'm not sure if I missed the explanation of why you're not a fan of basket muzzles (please forgive me if I did). I use the Baskerville Ultra Muzzle and we love it! Zeek can drink, take treats, pant, etc. through the muzzle. Because it has a head strap, if they are inclined, especially in the beginning, to try and paw it off, the muzzle won't come off. (If your super worried that they might somehow try and get out of it, a collar can be threaded through the muzzle.)

If you do decide to give it a go, the Baskerville size 6 fits Zeek perfectly.

 

[musicdeb]

I had to go find the link, but MusicDeb ordered one from here for her DDB and last I paid attention still liked it: Mastiff harness, Mastiff muzzle, Mastiff collar, Dog leash, Dog Lead

Yes, I like the muzzle. I have to use it when I take Titan for a vet visit. The company is awesome to work with. The muzzle has real leather strapping and they have a measuring page.

 

[DennasMom]

Deb - which version did you get?

I like the look of the all leather baskets better... they look more comfortable. Not sure if looks transcribes to actual comfort for the dog, though...

We used a nylon one on our bulldog/boxer mix. It did not let him pant, and I could see that was a bad thing for such a short-nosed dog.

 

[musicdeb]

I have the following. Sorry for the huge font, I copied and pasted from the site. Here's the link:

Looking for Mastiff Muzzles? Buy Now Adjustable Wire Basket Dog Muzzle
[h=1]Perfect Airflow Mastiff Wire Basket Dog Muzzle[/h]

 

[ruthcatrin]

Winterspring, not sure we really answered all of your original question. For the extra skin around the neck don't worry about it, just make sure the collar fits comfortably with a few fingers worth of space when its on. For the muzzle measurements check the instructions for the muzzle you're looking at, some places tell you to measure snug, some say to leave X amount of extra space.

 

[chuckorlando]

I think a basket is easier on the dog. Less restictive. And they can drink and snack and all that jazz.

 

[ruthcatrin]

I understand that padding is pretty much a MUST, and I want him to be able to vocalize (including a warning growl), drink, accept treats when he's behaving, so I like the muzzles that are bands around the face with straps attaching it to the head.

Btw, your dog CANNOT do any of those things with an occlusion style muzzle. The whole point of them is that they hold the mouth closed. If its loose enough that the dog can open its mouth to drink, accept treats, pant, etc then its loose enough that the dog can bite.

 

[Winterspring]

This was the one we were thinking of getting. It seems that the comfort requirements are met, as well as the comfort requirements for Taurus's particular needs (being able to touch his nose to my hand for comfort, being able to sniff stuff in his particular style, and thunk me in the hip). They have a spiked one, too, which would lend itself well to the "do not pet" vibe, but I really don't feel like getting stabbed each time he's feeling affectionate. They also have plain ones. With no studs at all. You know. Stuff. The basket ones just give me the creeps. I mean, I don't even think I'd want to pet my dog with that thing on. I know I don't have the most congenial dog in the world, but I'd like him to at least look like I'm just taking precautions (not that this style seems to be any less effective according to the following description) instead of guarding the world from him.

"Learn some advantages that will be available to you if you buy this amazing muzzle:

Long walks together with your dog. Not every muzzle can be used for this purpose as each one has its own function. This one is perfect for it as it is rather light in weight, has open-snout and...it is super stylish! Due to these features your dog can be muzzled longer, breathe and pant free even during highly active work, as well as bark and drink water.

It makes this muzzle indispensable for some hard training sessions - you don’t need to take it off each time when your dog is thirsty.

Please, pay attention! It is not recommended to wear it for a long time in very hot weather because leather is a good material for keeping heat and it can cause some inconveniences for your dog.

Safety with pleasure. You probably know that a dog needs to open his jaws very wide so to bite his “target” and the main purpose of this muzzle not to let him do it. Thus, the jaws are kept tight enough to prevent biting but your dog is not deprived of pleasure of life as he can play with your children, sniff them affectionately and lick their cheeks. You know, actually, kids are also very excited when they can caress the dog’s nose and snout - don’t be afraid to allow them do it!"

http://www.mastiff-dog-breed-store.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=3&products_id=864

I don't buy the "dont be afraid to allow [children to pet them with the muzzle on]" thing, but I like the rest of it.

The only other thing is that whole collar/muzzle/halter combo. Do I need a collar with a halter? Would adding a collar to the "ensemble" just be overkill? I'm always concerned that a dog will break out of whatever he's wearing and get lost with no tags. Am I being paranoid?

I'm being paranoid, aren't I.

 

[ruthcatrin]

A dog panting on a hot day has his mouth open pretty far. Regardless of their statement otherwise theres no way I'd use an occlusion style muzzle for any extended period of time.

 

[Winterspring]

Of course, now that I think about it, it's not like I'm only going to be getting one muzzle...One is never enough with me on anything. >_< So I suppose I can get both and make the judgment call on which muzzle to use during whatever situation I may be entering.

I have a friend that does leatherworking, and may have to take it up.