What's new
Mastiff Forum

This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

  • Welcome back!

    We decided to spruce things up and fix some things under the hood. If you notice any issues, feel free to contact us as we're sure there are a few things here or there that we might have missed in our upgrade.

stud fee???

ashe_cat

New Member
Hey my name's Ashlea, and we're trying to breed our EM for the frst time and aren't sure what's an acceptable stud fee to ask for. Our baby's name is Odis, he's gonna be 2 in december, he's absolutely beautiful and hast the best personality and temperament you could ever ask for in a dog. I know he's a purebred, but I don't know if he's papered. So I figured I'd advice from a community with more experience than me.
 

ruthcatrin

Well-Known Member
If you don't know if he's papered then he's never been shown, do you work him? Why do you want to breed him??
 

kevinmuaythai

Well-Known Member
Well as you know 2 isn't full grown. So the dog will not appearance wise fully represent himself, or the breed.Does the dog have any titles, I.E. conformation, working etc. These are valuable traits when it comes to breeding, in fact many breeders now want CH dogs only to breed, and won't even allow you to breed one of their puppies you may have bought unless you show it to CH first.

Just because your dog is a purebred doesn't necessarily mean you can ask anything for a stud fee. I'm sure breeders on here will be better suited to answer this in detail though
 

raechiemay

Well-Known Member
Honestly, I don't see any good reason in your post as to why you should breed him. I agree that he is too young at this point. Are you planning to do health testing on him? Were his parents health tested? He may be a gorgeous dog but unless you know he is a healthy, "correct" sire to his future pups, then you don't really have a logical reason to breed him. Not trying to be rude, just stating the facts.

I hope others will come & give you further information as to exactly what you should consider but as far as I'm concerned, I wouldn't pay a fee to have an unregistered, not tested male to breed with my female. Not even sure if the pups would be able to be registered if your dog is not.
 

ashe_cat

New Member
We've had him since he was 2 months old and we've never shown him. We don't really care about champion blood lines or anything like that. We're looking to breed him because he really is the perfect family dog and we're always having people commenting on how sweet he is and asking if we breed him and are interested in puppies.
 

kevinmuaythai

Well-Known Member
Well.......I'm not sure what to say, if you're not trying to better the breed by putting time into it then why ask for any fee? You don't know if he's papered. He hasn't had health tests(all of which won't be cheap).It sounds more like you want to get money to reproduce your family pet. If people comment on him why not give them the name of good EM breeders, many people on here know them.
 

ashe_cat

New Member
Firstly, I said I was new to this. I know he's not fully grown and I don't know if he's papered because I'm not the one who bought him. my boyfriend knows more than I do. I never said he wasn't tested or that we wouldn't get him tested. my boyfriend asked me if I could look into it online so I asked here.
 

Smokeycat

Well-Known Member
I have to agree with the others. Everyone comments on how gorgeous, calm, well behaved my EM is. He is still intact which causes people to ask when I plan to breed him and I have had people ask to get one of his pups. He's not registered and that alone makes him the end of his bloodline. If he had papers I MIGHT consider going thru the whole showing/testing thing and then breeding him.
 

ruby55

Well-Known Member
Your dog needs to be registered. He should undergo many health clearance tests; I'm not sure what is recommended for EM's; that's something you should be researching. IF he passes all his health tests, after the age of 2, mind you; and IF he's registered with an acceptable group or club; and IF he at least has titled ancestors, you could consider breeding him.
As far as stud fees go: if he's not titled, then you're not going to get anything for studding him. Sorry; that's just the way it is.
And breeding him for temperament is wonderful, but if he's not had and passed his health clearances, it would be very wrong to breed him. There are many dogs out there with excellent temperaments, but it doesn't mean they should sire a litter.
You would be better off if you wait awhile, and make sure he's a good representation of your breed. He's still very young. You can work at getting all the criteria done, & still have many years of service from him.
 

Mooshi's Mummy

Well-Known Member
Your dog needs to be registered. He should undergo many health clearance tests; I'm not sure what is recommended for EM's; that's something you should be researching. IF he passes all his health tests, after the age of 2, mind you; and IF he's registered with an acceptable group or club; and IF he at least has titled ancestors, you could consider breeding him.
As far as stud fees go: if he's not titled, then you're not going to get anything for studding him. Sorry; that's just the way it is.
And breeding him for temperament is wonderful, but if he's not had and passed his health clearances, it would be very wrong to breed him. There are many dogs out there with excellent temperaments, but it doesn't mean they should sire a litter.
You would be better off if you wait awhile, and make sure he's a good representation of your breed. He's still very young. You can work at getting all the criteria done, & still have many years of service from him.
Perfectly said!
 

BlackShadowCaneCorso

Super Moderator
Staff member
Your dog needs to be registered. He should undergo many health clearance tests; I'm not sure what is recommended for EM's; that's something you should be researching. IF he passes all his health tests, after the age of 2, mind you; and IF he's registered with an acceptable group or club; and IF he at least has titled ancestors, you could consider breeding him.
As far as stud fees go: if he's not titled, then you're not going to get anything for studding him. Sorry; that's just the way it is.
And breeding him for temperament is wonderful, but if he's not had and passed his health clearances, it would be very wrong to breed him. There are many dogs out there with excellent temperaments, but it doesn't mean they should sire a litter.
You would be better off if you wait awhile, and make sure he's a good representation of your breed. He's still very young. You can work at getting all the criteria done, & still have many years of service from him.

I agree with Ruby! Please read carefully what she has written and if you are truly interested in bettering the breed and think your dog could contribute then she has given you the info to get started. There are way to many dogs in shelters and rescues that had the same reasons you have for breeding :(
 

ruthcatrin

Well-Known Member
What Ruby said. Temporment's great, and certinally something that is PART of what should be considered when breeding, but its only PART, and if he's not passed health testing then please don't breed him. A great temporment doesn't mean that he can't pass on health problems. And without papers and/or titles and/or proof of working ability you're not going to get much of anything stud fee wise.
 

Duetsche_Doggen

Well-Known Member
I agree with everyone else.

2 years is "young" for these guys, remember mastiffs don't mature until 3 years or so depending on the line. Personally I'd be more concerned about health tests than titles. I'm not sure what issues plague the mastiff breed but better safe than sorry. Plus for those potential puppy buyers they don't go through the hardships of heartbreak and finances because of something that could have been easily avoidable with testing. People assume that their dog is "healthy" however you never know for sure until you test.

If you plan to breed him for his temperament have him tested on that as well. Look up Temperament Test (TT) around your area this will give you a better idea of how your dogs temp "truly" is. Or look into getting a Canine Good Citizens (CGC), not the best thing for evaluating temperament but its something.

What about the bitch? How does she look? What's her background? Will she have health tests done as well? Are you doing a natural or artificial? What plans have you worked out with the owners?

Also be wary of "potential buyers", you may have people lined up now but people change quite frequently. Even "seasoned" breeders are not guaranteed all their pups will find homes, so be prepared for that. Then of course interviewing potential buyers. Are you willing to take a pup back if the previous owners cannot keep it? What are your guarantees for the pups?

Don't just sell to any person that comes along waving money or the promise of a "good home." People aren't always what they appear to be, that "dream family" could be your pups worse nightmare

Most of the people here " have been there done that" and only want the breed's best interest. Its very easy to ruin dog breeds but VERY DIFFICULT to fix them. Its your dog so your going to do as you please, just try not to take the information given with a grain of salt. Cheers.
 

shodanusmc

Well-Known Member
Do not take this the wrong way, but have your dog neutered, and enjoy him as a family pet. You would not be bettering the breed at all, and you know nothing about it. There is more to it than he has a nice temperment. If you want to create a bandog, find a female pit and have at it. No registration, no testing, no working, no showing. Nope, sorry. You could not pay me to stud your dog.
 

Cody

Well-Known Member
I agree with what the others have said.
You love your dog and tha is awesome, but loving your dog is not enough of a reason to breed him.
Breeding a dog is a serious commitment, especially large breeds.
There are a few posts here in Back Yard Breeders that you may want to read.
The reason there are dog shows is to have an independant party judge your dogs over all structure to that of the standard, to prove, so to speak, that your dog is worthy of being bred.
Breeders are not just throwing dogs together, or good ones aren't at least. They are carefully selecting a bitch/stud that compliments the other. They are looking at certain faults in their dog and trying to "fix" those faults over generations.
It takes huge amounts of time investigating individual dogs and pedigrees.
Breeding is not a whim.
Please read some threads and really give this serious thought.
 

Tailcreek

Well-Known Member
I thought I would chime in regarding the typical health testing that is performed on English Mastiffs before breeding takes place:

Hips/Elbows - either certified by OFA or PENNHIP
Eyes - CERF exam by an opthomologist, DNA test for Progressive Retinal Atrophy (PRA)
Heart - Cardiac examination
Cystinuria - DNA test
The above tests would be considered the minimum acceptable. However there are several other conditions it is recommended to test for:
Thyroid - certified with OFA
Eyes - DNA test for Canine Multifocal retinopathy (CMR)
Patellas - certified with OFA
Degenerative Myelopathy - DNA test

It is ethical to test a dog before it is bred. Having a litter of pups without this testing being in place it is quite likely that the offspring could develop a serious hereditary condition. This can be devastating for the family that has purchased the pup. Not to mention the possible suffering or short lifespan of the dog. Breeding without health testing in my opinion is irresponsible and unethical.

Jennifer
www.tailcreekmastiffs.com
www.thenaturalcarnivore.com
 

DennasMom

Well-Known Member
I'm just going to throw this out there... since it's kind of on topic... but it's really just out of curiosity...

If I think I have the perfect EM (hypothetically), can I purchase an official evaluation for structure? Or MUST you go through the whole dog show deal? I've heard horror stories about showing dogs, and it takes a LOT of time, effort and money... which I give Kudos to breeders (or anyone!) who goes through that, and understand why championship purebred lines are more expensive... but, is there any other way to get confirmation that your dog is "true to the standard"??
 

ruthcatrin

Well-Known Member
Some of the puppy mill registries do it that way. They don't hold shows, the dog gets (supposedly) looked over by a "judge" and give a certificate of 'championship'. Doesn't mean anything.

If its for your own peace of mind theres no reason you couldn't have a couple AKC judges give you their opinion, but thats all it would be.
 

Duetsche_Doggen

Well-Known Member
Some of the puppy mill registries do it that way. They don't hold shows, the dog gets (supposedly) looked over by a "judge" and give a certificate of 'championship'. Doesn't mean anything.

If its for your own peace of mind theres no reason you couldn't have a couple AKC judges give you their opinion, but thats all it would be.

That's another reason I have issues with shows, unless the dog is just a structural mess how can one tell a "perfect" specimen from the next? I feel as though is pretty much one judges opinion vs another. :/
 

ruthcatrin

Well-Known Member
Oh it is, not arguing with that! In THEORY to get an AKC championship a dog has to win over other dogs under several judges which is supposed to help minimize the effects of a strongly opinioned judge.

Edit: its by no means a perfect system, and personally I'd be perfectly happy to accept a titled agility champion or schutzhund champion as appropriate for breeding (health testing not optional!) as much as a conformation champion. And a dog who has both their conformation championship AND a working title? Well you just made my day. And working dogs who excell at their job counts too IMO, but without titles or at least papers of some kind the worth of the stud fee is going to be nill, and no matter what health testing is a must.
 
Last edited: