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Opinion on the purity of this puppy

belawyer

Well-Known Member
Hi, I’m new to the forum so hopefully I am not breaking any rules with my first post. I’m in the market for a Bullmastiff. I’m looking for opinions on the purity of this puppy I found from a backyard breeder near me. Does this appear to be a legitimate Bullmastiff because the mom and dad both appear slightly mutty to me?

See attached pictures of the sire,dam, and puppy. Thanks!
 

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Boxergirl

Well-Known Member
It appears there are three different adult dogs shown there. Which are supposed to be the parents? I would never, ever pay $1200 for a back yard bred dog. You can go to a responsible breeder and pay just a little more. While there are no guarantees, a puppy from parents that have been appropriately health tested for genetic conditions increases the likelihood that you will avoid certain painful and costly conditions in the future.
 

belawyer

Well-Known Member
It appears there are three different adult dogs shown there. Which are supposed to be the parents? I would never, ever pay $1200 for a back yard bred dog. You can go to a responsible breeder and pay just a little more. While there are no guarantees, a puppy from parents that have been appropriately health tested for genetic conditions increases the likelihood that you will avoid certain painful and costly conditions in the future.

Well I just said "backyard breeder" not really knowing what makes a breeder a not backyard breeder? Because all the Bullmastiff breeders in TX appear to keep the dogs in their "backyard"...lol. So maybe I need a little more help on how to differentiate.

This particular breeder I posted above was originally found on the AKC website. Here is the AKC post http://marketplace.akc.org/miki-alexander-27205/bullmastiff-106354. Subsquently, I came across their craigslist post which is the link I posted above. Does that make them a non-backyard breeder?

They didn't have as fancy a dedicated website as a couple other Bullmastiff Breeders I found in TX and their prices also weren't over $2k.
 

Nik

Well-Known Member
Hmm well most reputable breeders won't advertise on craigslist because they are very selective in who they sell to. That said I have seen some reputable breeders advertise in all sorts of places including craigslist but if they are reputable they won't just sell to you. They will interview you first to make sure you are a good home for their dogs. If they are reputable they will have paperwork on the parents, health check records for the dogs, full vet records, etc.

A fancy website does not a good breeder make. A good breeder is someone who takes very good care of their dogs, is working towards the betterment of the breed and has a vested interest in the homes their puppies go to.

If they are anything less then a good reputable breeder (no health checks, no vet records, no paperwork, etc.) then $1200 is way too much money. When you buy from a backyard breeder you are gambling. You don't know the genetics, you don't know what health issues lurk in their dna, etc. I am not one to say don't do it. But, I will say 1200 $ is too much to take that gamble. So basically find out if this breeder has all the paperwork. Did they do health screens? Do they have vet stuff? If they ask a lot of questions about you and have all the right paperwork you are probably safe. If you are still uneasy ask for references as well. But, if your gut tells you these people aren't reputable then maybe keep looking...
 

Nik

Well-Known Member
Hmm well most reputable breeders won't advertise on craigslist because they are very selective in who they sell to. That said I have seen some reputable breeders advertise in all sorts of places including craigslist but if they are reputable they won't just sell to you. They will interview you first to make sure you are a good home for their dogs. If they are reputable they will have paperwork on the parents, health check records for the dogs, full vet records, etc.

A fancy website does not a good breeder make. A good breeder is someone who takes very good care of their dogs, is working towards the betterment of the breed and has a vested interest in the homes their puppies go to.

If they are anything less then a good reputable breeder (no health checks, no vet records, no paperwork, etc.) then $1200 is way too much money. When you buy from a backyard breeder you are gambling. You don't know the genetics, you don't know what health issues lurk in their dna, etc. I am not one to say don't do it. But, I will say 1200 $ is too much to take that gamble. So basically find out if this breeder has all the paperwork. Did they do health screens? Do they have vet stuff? If they ask a lot of questions about you and have all the right paperwork you are probably safe. If you are still uneasy ask for references as well. But, if your gut tells you these people aren't reputable then maybe keep looking...

Okay so I just looked at your CL ad and I do like that the breeder has had dew claws removed, has akc paperwork and has dewormed. These are good first signs. Backyard breeders (the kind you want to avoid anyways) won't usually do anything. They don't want to incur the extra cost of putting money into deworming, dew claw removal etc. It isn't a gaurantee that they are good but it is a good first sign. Ask the questions, visit them and then make a decision.
 

Boxergirl

Well-Known Member
AKC doesn't mean anything. This breeder doesn't test their dogs, nor are they a member of any breed clubs. They don't participate in any events like showing, obedience, agility, or other events. It says so on the akc marketplace page. This, to me, is a backyard breeder. I see nothing that warrants a $1200 price for these pups.
 

Nik

Well-Known Member
AKC doesn't mean anything. This breeder doesn't test their dogs, nor are they a member of any breed clubs. They don't participate in any events like showing, obedience, agility, or other events. It says so on the akc marketplace page. This, to me, is a backyard breeder. I see nothing that warrants a $1200 price for these pups.

I see. I didn't check the AKC page. You definitely want a breeder that tests their dogs at minimum.
 

Boxergirl

Well-Known Member
I hope I'm not sounding snobby. I've had my share of rescue dogs, mixes, and backyard bred dogs. All dogs deserve a good home. It's just very important to me that I give my money to someone that I feel has the best intentions for the breeds that I love. I don't feel that this person is a responsible breeder looking to better the breed. If someone does choose to pay a reasonable fee for a backyard bred dog, I would highly recommend purchasing pet insurance immediately. Without the pertinent health tests having been done, you just don't have any idea what health issues might show up.
 

Boxergirl

Well-Known Member
Okay. I did a little more snooping. I don't feel that this is a typical backyard breeder. The ad wasn't a good representation of them. I found their website and their dogs do look to be in good condition and well loved. They don't appear to do any genetic testing, so I still feel that the price is too high. They don't appear to show or do other activities. My main issue with them would be that there is no health testing listed on the website. I don't feel that vet checks are acceptable, nor is the 1 year health guarantee. Most issue can't even be tested until the dogs are 2 years old. I would also want to know how often these dogs are/have been bred and at what age were they first bred. My choice would be to pass at this price, but that is just my opinion.
 

AKBull

Super Moderator
Staff member
I checked the ad, and visited their FB page. Personally, I'm not a fan on the sir, and don't think he should have been bred. Hopefully the pups will look more like the Dam...
And I'd expect that price for this type of breeding. That's my take anyway.
 

Boxergirl

Well-Known Member
I checked the ad, and visited their FB page. Personally, I'm not a fan on the sir, and don't think he should have been bred. Hopefully the pups will look more like the Dam...
And I'd expect that price for this type of breeding. That's my take anyway.

AKBull, really? What about this breeding makes the pups $1200 pups? I'm honestly curious. No testing and no titles of any kind. I just don't see anything really special about the sire and dam.
 

Nik

Well-Known Member
AKBull, really? What about this breeding makes the pups $1200 pups? I'm honestly curious. No testing and no titles of any kind. I just don't see anything really special about the sire and dam.

I'm with Boxergirl on the pricing. Too much $ for too little. Neither of my dogs are purebred but I also didn't pay anything for either. Now my Cerberus who has since passed was purebred (standard poodle) and his family did genetic testing, health gaurantees, vet checks etc., showed their dogs, and was basically fabulous in every way. But, even he was only $200 (granted this was many years ago) but they charged me next to nothing because they felt he did't meet the breed standard closely enough and they had a strongly worded no breeding policy/no showing policy for him because of it (pet quality only). Now his siblings who they felt did meet the quality they were looking for were well upwards of $1000. For me I didn't care about whether he met the standard. I was looking for a pet and only cared that he was healthy which he was. He lived a long life and we didn't run into any major medical issues with him.

That said I have seen many breeders who would likely fall in the backyard or borderline category charging even more than this. People will pay it. But, I won't.
 

belawyer

Well-Known Member
Okay. I did a little more snooping. I don't feel that this is a typical backyard breeder. The ad wasn't a good representation of them. I found their website and their dogs do look to be in good condition and well loved. They don't appear to do any genetic testing, so I still feel that the price is too high. They don't appear to show or do other activities. My main issue with them would be that there is no health testing listed on the website. I don't feel that vet checks are acceptable, nor is the 1 year health guarantee. Most issue can't even be tested until the dogs are 2 years old. I would also want to know how often these dogs are/have been bred and at what age were they first bred. My choice would be to pass at this price, but that is just my opinion.

with my limited knowledge of breeders I think you articulated well in this response what I was kind of thinking but didn't know how to put my finger on it...
 

belawyer

Well-Known Member
Only because that's the pricing I've seen them go for. That's the BYB price point. Add the testing and what not, then you're looking at $1,600 and up pup. Just my experience. :)

From my shopping around just for the past few days I do think AKBull is right with his pricing. The $1,200 was lower end of range and $2,200 was higher end of range. So that puts AKBull's price of $1,600 mid-range....
 

Boxergirl

Well-Known Member
I have paid a for a dog from health tested parents and very good bloodlines. That was $1100 for a boxer with bloodlines that were consistently at Westminster. He's a pet quality dog, not show quality. That was a very reasonable price. I paid $600 for my Roy, also a boxer. He came from hobby breeders that did minimal health testing and bred for therapy, service, agility, and obedience. I felt both of these prices were fair.

This is my opinion only, but just because some people are asking (and presumably getting) $1200 for a pup with no health testing, titles, or proof of working ability, it doesn't mean that it's an acceptable price. If people would stop paying that much for these dogs then the low end price for pups from untested parents would go down. It's not much different than paying a lot of money to a pet store for a dog, IMO. A puppy from a responsible breeder that health tests and either shows or in some other way competes with their dogs is expensive because of the money that they put into them. It's not cheap to show or compete. Health testing isn't inexpensive. Responsible breeders are lucky to break even. I'm with Nik on this. Too much for too little.