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I'm getting frustrated with the lack of response

Catia

Well-Known Member
sorry, here's the pics.

Tessa & her 1st crayfish.
Insane tail fur
back fur thick & long enough you can't see my fingers
hanging out in my chair
hanging out on the sofa
 

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Catia

Well-Known Member
Tessa loves camping, hiking & especially swimming.
She needed no training what so ever in being a *Tibetan Footwarmer* on a chilly evening after much fun!
 

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ruthcatrin

Well-Known Member
The picture of her on your chair, I can SO see TM (or something similer anyway), and yah, it looks like your hopes for a Rottie coat aren't going to happen lol. And yah, thats a very TM sort of response to training" "we already did this, you know I know it, why for are you asking AGAIN?!"
 

Mooshi's Mummy

Well-Known Member
Her ass end looks typically female tm! Also the love of water and hiking and coat. she may be a cross but what ever she is she has tm in her no doubt. It's prominent and clear IMO.
 

Catia

Well-Known Member
I had a detailed discussion with the "Dr/geneticist", Angela at Mars. I gotta update that thread, as I got a brand new DNA test kit, but haven't sent it in yet.

Anyway, based on the original test, the geneticist feels strongly Tessa is definitely full half golden retriever.
Her other 1/2 is something that can't be tested for accurately, or could not be properly read from the 1st test, such as TM.

I asked about TM, & yes, TM lines get screwy when testing, just like you said they would!
I think maybe they throw it off because it depending on when the line came from, for example, American TM DNA after a few generations of breeding with other TM's here is apparently very different from lines across the pond, & vastly different in China where they are mixing in chow & EM or BM because they are breeding for a look & no the true pooch as a working dog. Some people are trying to preserve the breed, some are trying to make $$ based on appearances, & a true standard is not being practiced for preserving the breed, aside from a few small pockets in the Himalaya's & there's not as much $$ for that cause.

I was told definitely no shepherd, no rottie, no chow, & NO MALTESE lol--

I will complete the new test kit sometime soon, I forgot it was even sitting here. , but suffice to say, mistake was admitted about the maltese.
I just don't know if I trust they will do a retest for real, or if they just sent me the test kit to appease me & will give me the same results--

I've just settled into the TM/Golden retriever, because it makes sense--she retrieves like she was born into it--*when she is in the water*--

She looks BIG in that chair, but she's maybe only 75lbs, it's a small recliner.
She's my "tea cup" poochie lol
 

Catia

Well-Known Member
9.5 months--but she still seems little to me.

Some guy with a 20lb white terrier/schnauzer type mix was making a fuss at Tessa & he was asking about her, the said, "We can let them meet, I don't think she's gonna hurt him, (as Tessa sat like an angel)"
I said "I'm worried your pooch will hurt her, she's just a baby"--He just looked at me like I made a joke.
 

ruthcatrin

Well-Known Member
You should see people's faces when I tell them Apollo still has filling out to do lol

And yah, Apollo never looks big, till I see him next to aother dog!
 

Catia

Well-Known Member
So on the coat issue--Tessa still has not shed.

She a bath last week & a very small amount of undercoat type fur came out--not even enough to pull from the drain really.
It was mostly scattered here & there on the walls from her shaking dry.

Now her fur is growing THICK from underneath, but not pushing any old fur out.
What is coming in on her hind end--the undercoat coming in between her other fur--it doesn't feel like fur or hair--it feels like wool-almost like a solid mass of wool.

Actually, her fur--It felt just like that when I got her-her rear end puppy fur was so so thick-- it felt like sheared wool & was almost impossible to get her a proper bath, even though that fur was already clippered (not by me), I couldn't get to the skin, it did not feel oily at all--but was waterproof.

She still has places towards her front, like on her chest where it is still so thin you can easily see her skin.
Does the ass end generally come in 1st & not "all over" at the same time?

I'm afraid of this coat--& with good reason because it seems no end in site.

She still has no doggie smell at all--none--& that's just crazy-cuz well, she's a dog!

So do TM's keep their actual "hair" & only shed undercoat?
I've not seen *any* regular hairs come out at all & I pet her a lot & run my fingers through her fur a LOT since she hates being brushed.

From what I've been reading about golden retrievers, they shed from about 6 months of age & shed all year/every day, regardless of season, but of course they get a thick winter undercoat, they shed in the winter & shed in spring even more both their under coat & fur. Apparently they one one of the biggest shedders & the duration is constant.

So far, if Tessa were my only pet, I could get away with running a light vacuum 1x per week--but I have 2 cats, & they shed more in 1 week than Tessa has since I brought her home.

I know it's coming--the shed...
My only hope is that Tessa doesn't have the golden retriever fur shedding genes--I'd like to think since she has not started shedding yet, that's a good sign-because she'd be shedding regularly by now even if her winter coat is coming in from what I've read.



I am keeping fingers crossed, that if she is 1/2 golden retriever that she sheds like a TM instead
 

ruthcatrin

Well-Known Member
Apollo's coat comes in in spots. It sheds in spots too lol. He lost a LITTLE outercoat this past spring/summer, but by no means alot, and normally they really only shednthe undercoat. And yes, little to no doggy odor, and what odor Apollo gets isn't "doggy"! Its awesome lol. Watch those baths though, as that under coat comes in its going to start taking FOREVER for her to dry!
 

Primehns

Well-Known Member
sorry to drop in and i'm in no way saying i'm right, nor do i know a lot about tm's. But could your pup be a Hovawart, they look like golden retrievers but aren't, they are imposing and powerful guardians as well as protectors, i'm sure she could be a mix or full.
Hovawart_im_Schnee02.jpg


images



images
 

ruthcatrin

Well-Known Member
Hm, it IS one of the breeds that Wisdom Panel doesn't detect, and they are a guardian type, but where Wisdom panel is SURE about the half pure Golden I'd expect that if the other half was mostly Hovawart that the dog would look MORE retriever-ish, plus she's awefully big boned to be a mix of a Golden and a Hovawart......I donno, I can see the resemblance that makes you call Hovawart, but I'm not sure its correct.....if Wisdom panel wasn't sure about the Golden I'd say maybe thats what that half is.

Catia, if you get a minute can you measure her height? For Apollo I usually stand him up next to a wall (or door frame) and use a pencil to mark off his shoulder height and then measure that.
 

Primehns

Well-Known Member
23 - 28 inches
55 - 90 pounds
if you google search they look awfully like golden retrievers. Just thought i'd share my opinion.
 

ruthcatrin

Well-Known Member
OH definetly, and if we didn't have the Wisdom Panel saying that they're 100% that she's 1/2 golden I'd say its a definete possibility, I'm just not sure I'd go for Hovawart in a mix with a Golden to produce a dog that looks like Tessa. Plus her more mature pictures she looks heftier (at least to my eye) than both the Golden and the Hovawart.
 

Catia

Well-Known Member
Funny you mention Hovawart, it was actually a breed I considered, along with rottie/dane/em when I began my puppy quest looking for breeders.

The reason I did not proceed further-- after doing my research-- is because hovawarts are a very energetic breed.
A mellow, & low reactive hovawart just isn't going to happen for the most part. I was specifically looking for a breed that leans more towards mellow.

A retriever & a hovawart, in the golden color look so similar, but hovawart is a little heftier. I was looking at the black and tan hovawarts--that was my personal preference, I think hovawarts are just beautiful, & if I didn't have health issues that lessen my energy, I'd have totally gone for it.

Based on Tessa's temperament, which has been consistent across the board from day 1, I don't think hovawart is in the mix. She's just wayyyy tooo mellow & low reactive. Tessa simply will not waste the slightest amount of energy LOL, she will wait & see, & then she will wait & see some more. "Get up" was the HARDEST command to teach her.

As far as the Wisdom panel, & all of the drama that surrounded my test, & the fact that the 1st test came back as "maltese mix" & Mars using the wrong name when addressing me, & had wrong dog name, I still feel the entire test was bunk. They did send me another test, but my gut tells me they just will use the ID # on my 1st test to identify me, & give me the same results as the 1st test---Meaning, they will not actually run the 2nd test. This was the distinct impression I got after speaking with Angela Huges, the DVM/geneticist. She did not say this exactly--what she DID stress, multiple times, was that I was going to get the same exact results with the 2nd test, no matter what-- even though she admitted the maltese was a mistake on their part, but blamed it on a computer error.
What this meant to me was that they'll just identify me/flag my new test kit id#.
This is one of the reasons I have not sent the new test kit in, I just don't trust them due to the issues surrounding my 1st test.
I am looking for a company for testing that is NOT affiliated with Mars, but Mars purchased just about every one of those companies, & they keep the DNA in their data banks--if your pooch was tested previously--they DO NOT retest, apparently you will get a notice telling you that your pooch was already in their data bank & they will give you the same results as the original test--which I think is a load of crap.
I am also considering doing a DNA test in a different country--despite slight differences in breed, but I'd have to order the kit to that adr, have them ship to me, me do the test, ship back to them...

Could Tessa be 1/2 retriever--yes, & I say this because she retireves & loves to retrieve in water --My last girl was rottie/shepherd/dane & she also loved retrieving in water & swimming in general, just as much as Tessa. Aside from retrieving, she doesn't have much retriever personality, & she certainly doesn't train like a retriever.