Breeder vs Puppy Mill what's different ??

Discussion in 'Breeder Discussion' started by Countrygirl, Mar 29, 2013.

  1. Countrygirl

    Countrygirl Member

    ok let me see if I get this strait...lol, showing a breed is more important than the bloodline they come from that's considered a working breed? and the higher the title the better off you are as a breeder right? lol
     
  2. Geisthexe

    Geisthexe Banned

    You need to go back up and read.

    But it really depends on the breed.. Even in the guardian/working group (our breeds) MOST are no longer working dogs. So the ONLY thing they have is show. Lineage only plays a good part of that breed is still working.

    CCs, Presas, Filas, G
    Dogos (example) are still working dogs and prove it all the time

    EMs, DDB, Bulls etc (example) do not work so there is NO way to prove in lineage of working.

    If the lines go back 4 generations it really doesn't mean squat bc it's to far away to say working dog lineage

    Understand? :)
     
  3. Countrygirl

    Countrygirl Member

    gotcha!! thanks so much :D
     
  4. Cody

    Cody Well-Known Member

    No one said that. As for the bloodline, well that is subjective. Because one person likes one type of CC from a particular blood line, doesn't mean another will. There has been lots of "mixing" that can be seen in some bloodines more then in others. In some the boxer/BM influence is more apparent then the Corso ;) As for showing, it is supposed to be comparing the individual dog against the written standard, which at this point of time for the CC is based on a working breed. Form to function, meaning that the Corso standard is written to promote the dog best suited structurally to achieve it's purpose as a working breed. It should not be the be all end all. Just because a breeder has a GCH on one of their dogs does not make them a great breeder, or even a good one. In my opinion I want to see various titles or dogs working towards them, including but not limited to IPO, Ringsport, Agility, OB, weight pull, luring, HIT as well as the very minimum CGC/CGN titles, Therapy titles, ATTS... The Corso was NOT a one trick pony, it was a utilitarian breed. These dogs should be able to go as far as you are willing to take them. A breeder with multiple dogs doing multiple tasks, who still maintains a consistent type, is what I personally look for in a successful breeder.
     
  5. Tiger12490

    Tiger12490 Well-Known Member

    I understand what your saying but there are breeders that have never and wont ever test ...and there dogs come out with less problems than the ones that do test....because the testing does not mean your dog wont be displastic nor does it mean the offspring wont be.....im going to do it with Kronos for the hell of it...but there are a zillion dogs around the world who work there entire lives with no problems and they haven't been tested...I think health testing is more crucial in dogs that dont get worked...sometimes the work can test the dog for you..just my 2 cents

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I317 using Tapatalk 2
     
  6. Duetsche_Doggen

    Duetsche_Doggen Well-Known Member

    This is what happens when showing gets out of hand, which is why I don't care much for showing. Dog doesn't have its ear cropped, what? Not the right color....please...... Judges and breeders start looking for "new trends." For example with my breed, with the type of dane I have I could not show because its not "preferable" in the ring. Now over the last few years my type of dane is the "in" thing right now. As with anything the recycling trend continues the outcome can be worse or better than it was before.

    Usually for working breeds its the at worse. Which is why JR and Border Collie folks did not want the breed to be registered by kennel clubs. Whether your a breeder, judge, show, working or "pet" owner the idea should be to preserve the breed. That means the WHOLE dog not just bits like lack of temperament poor health, weak nerves, poor structure etc. Again everyone has their idea of the "correct" dog. IMO the only "correct" breeds were breeds back in their hay day. Or breeds "untouched" by the modern world.

    Tiger, I believe if the tools are there for health test I would use. But for breeds that are "rare" in other countries I'd take a gamble as they "test" their dogs in other venues. IMO of course.......
     
  7. Duetsche_Doggen

    Duetsche_Doggen Well-Known Member

    Countrygirl,

    For puppy mill, just think of a production line for dogs. Sad but true people pump out pups for cash without a second thought for breed or its health..
     
  8. Kujo

    Kujo Well-Known Member

    Just curious...is there any money in showing? Do the winners actually make a profit after all the traveling and dog expenses are calculated? Or is the purpose of showing to bring more esteem to your dog so you can then breed it and THEN make a profit? Or is showing just a wonderful expensive hobby? Like horseback riding.
     
  9. Duetsche_Doggen

    Duetsche_Doggen Well-Known Member

    Depends on the breeder but yes some do make BANK. Like race horses.

    Like any venue sport or show its EXPENSIVE and the profits made are no where near the amount spent. But if you love your hobby cost, shouldn't matter. :)
     
  10. Cody

    Cody Well-Known Member

    I agree 100%, but because a dog can move and jump doesn't mean it is not dysplastic ;) . I would not rule out a dog that doesn't have great hips on that alone, but KNOWING what the dogs hips are is, for me at least, is one piece of the puzzle. I know a dog that is dysplastic, but have seen this dog move effortlessly and jump like there is no tomorrow, when he gaits he floats. It is a dog I have seen in person, played flirt pole with, so know his movement first hand. His off spring have been quite successful. Luckily he can't read an x-ray, so is unaware of his condition :D I have also seen dogs with great hips on the X-Ray who have horrible movement and structure. I just think if we have access to these tools why not utilise them.
     
  11. Kujo

    Kujo Well-Known Member

    That's what I thought! I rode horses for years and did some shows, never made a dime off it, sure did spend a lot! I wouldn't trade those years for anything though :) Thanks for responding :)
     
  12. Duetsche_Doggen

    Duetsche_Doggen Well-Known Member

    I'm jealous, haha, I would love to ride and do gaming events but horses terrify me, lol.
     
  13. Cody

    Cody Well-Known Member

    I just enjoy throwing money away :) My breeder is VERY selective about who can use his dogs (as am I and we have a mutual agreement in regards to this), neither he nor I will recoup what we have put into Black Jack achieving his AKC and CKC Ch. But making money was never the intent.
     
  14. Kujo

    Kujo Well-Known Member

    lol, I get it, they are VERY big animals and could do some serious damage if they wanted to. After 8 years of riding I was at the peak of my skill and, of course, I fall off and bang up my knee so bad that I never really rode again. But it was wonderful while it lasted :)
     
  15. Kujo

    Kujo Well-Known Member

    Well that's a hobby in itself! lol
     
  16. Cody

    Cody Well-Known Member

    Oh believe me, I excel at that hobby lmao!
     
  17. Geisthexe

    Geisthexe Banned

    In dog showing it is illegal to offer money as a winning gift to BOS .. A club in Richmond VA did it 200.00 for BOS and UKC banned them for a year for doing shows.
    Some of your specialties will offer money but thats few and far between. Your so called money is the pups you produce but then thats a crap shoot too b/c you have to breed like a Puppy Mill to show a profit.

    DD is correct in horses make breeders, owners, handlers bank if done right
     
  18. Kujo

    Kujo Well-Known Member

    what about the agility competitions...are cash prizes also illegal in that sport?
     
  19. Kujo

    Kujo Well-Known Member

    I'm sorry...these questions should really be it's own thread. Sorry for diverting from the original topic.
     
  20. Geisthexe

    Geisthexe Banned

    In most dog stuff there is no money won from Agility, obedience, rally, flyball, protection etc .. its more about the passion in what we love to do. not for making a profit
     

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