Breeder Beware

[catheyscanecorsos]

I have been in love & educating myself with the breed for going on 8yrs. I have produced a few litters. Health testing... I have prelim tested & am in the process of finishing our Penn Hip with Lucian. I am being educated with my mentor's with other testings that I am going to be doing with my stock. I have & still do work with Alcor's (Derek), Maximo Kennels ((Max). Elaborate... No. If you want to know each of their numbers are list on their website call them & ask. I RESPECT both these wonderful breeders & I can't say one bad thing about either of them. But if your asking if I do anything with Scanifio (scandy) Nope! LOL! I am going to tell you as I have told MANY breeders... Your productions are your artwork & NOBODY has the same taste when you are in the same field! Everyone is going to bash you & try to tell you how YOU should feed, show & breed. However, I will stand my ground & I will not budge!!!! As for health testing I have nothing to prove to anyone. Because health testing is for the breeder to evaluate before the breeding takes place to insure that all should turn out as good as it does on paper! There is no such thing as a perfect dog (corsi) or I haven't seen any yet that's for sure! LOL

 

[catheyscanecorsos]

Temperment... I have had some of my dogs evaluated by the same trainer & he seemed to be impressed with each & everyone of them.

 

[catheyscanecorsos]

Females vary from 90 lbs to 118

 

[Cody]

So the answers are no, your dogs are not officially health tested, nor any official temperament testing or any conformation CH's/Working titles. I am familiar with both Max and Alcor. So you have bred and sold Alcor/ Maximo a dog/s that Derek/ Max are using in their programs? Interesting... Your "productions are your artwork" well to some degree perhaps, but there is a written standard in place that in order to be an ethical and reputable breeder you must strive to breed to. With the CC form follows function. I am well aware of what health testing is for, however not quite as simple as what you have stated. " As for health testing I have nothing to prove to anyone. Because health testing is for the breeder to evaluate before the breeding takes place to insure that all should turn out as good as it does on paper!" yet you have bred without doing any official testing tells me quite a bit. No one was attacking or bashing you, you came onto the forum with many "puppy buyers" extolling your virtues as a breeder. As an ethical breeder one should be prepared to answer all of these questions and more without getting offended, defensive or snide.

 

[catheyscanecorsos]

No one is bashing me? I am very sorry but it seems that you just did. That is where these boards go... Bashing. Please keep your kennel within standard as we all do. I am working with my Mentor's & do not need another. Keep up your good work!

 

[Cody]

No one is bashing me? I am very sorry but it seems that you just did. That is where these boards go... Bashing. Please keep your kennel within standard as we all do. I am working with my Mentor's & do not need another. Keep up your good work!

Please, how did I bash you? I asked you relevant questions that any breeder should be able to answer, with out getting upset or feeling bashed. Your puppy buyer in an earlier post on this forum said that your dogs have health clearances and that you sold to well known kennels, I was simply asking for verification of these facts. Which I now have, thank you.

 

[coreyc]

I have been in love & educating myself with the breed for going on 8yrs. I have produced a few litters. Health testing... I have prelim tested & am in the process of finishing our Penn Hip with Lucian. I am being educated with my mentor's with other testings that I am going to be doing with my stock. I have & still do work with Alcor's (Derek), Maximo Kennels ((Max). Elaborate... No. If you want to know each of their numbers are list on their website call them & ask. I RESPECT both these wonderful breeders & I can't say one bad thing about either of them. But if your asking if I do anything with Scanifio (scandy) Nope! LOL! I am going to tell you as I have told MANY breeders... Your productions are your artwork & NOBODY has the same taste when you are in the same field! Everyone is going to bash you & try to tell you how YOU should feed, show & breed. However, I will stand my ground & I will not budge!!!! As for health testing I have nothing to prove to anyone. Because health testing is for the breeder to evaluate before the breeding takes place to insure that all should turn out as good as it does on paper! There is no such thing as a perfect dog (corsi) or I haven't seen any yet that's for sure! LOL

Let me get this right your you not have any Penn hip scores to give a client but yet you are breeding those dogs ? And health testing is only for you are you kidding I would want to know any problem's with the sire & dam before I gave you a deposit for a puppy !

 

[catheyscanecorsos]

I did answer your questions to what I feel you need to know. You are blaming me for something someone else said that I had to go back & read. I can not answer for that person so STOP blaming me for others actions. Then I try to explain to you what health testing I HAVE done & Bam you assume No I didn't do anything. Really! Oh don't worry about buying a pup from me cause I don't feel we would be on the same page... I don't pretend to be the corsi police! I came here to defend myself to a person that was making statements that are untrue & now I have to defend myself against someone who is suppose to be here on a form as support but that seems to not be the case at all! Sounds great! Nothing new here & you wonder why ppl don't come back unless they are your buddy or pal! Keep up the great work!

 

[el gato diablo]

I did answer your questions to what I feel you need to know. You are blaming me for something someone else said that I had to go back & read. I can not answer for that person so STOP blaming me for others actions. Then I try to explain to you what health testing I HAVE done & Bam you assume No I didn't do anything. Really! Oh don't worry about buying a pup from me cause I don't feel we would be on the same page... I don't pretend to be the corsi police! I came here to defend myself to a person that was making statements that are untrue & now I have to defend myself against someone who is suppose to be here on a form as support but that seems to not be the case at all! Sounds great! Nothing new here & you wonder why ppl don't come back unless they are your buddy or pal! Keep up the great work!

It has nothing to do with defense...it has everything to do with your responsibility as a breeder. If you feel you have to defend your health testing practices, or temperament testing...you're doing it wrong. These are aspects of breeding that you (as a breeder) should be championing on the forefront, and not things that others have to struggle to get you to divulge. Any breed stock that you use should be health and temperament TESTED...not evaluated by a trainer, not evaluated by your breeder friends...there are 3rd party agencies in place to test and certify your breed stock. The blunt truth is that you absolutely should not be using them if they are not formally tested. No one can look at a puppy and guarantee its health...even if the parents of your breed stock are health tested, that does not mean your dogs will be of sound health...there are recessive traits that can show up in an otherwise healthy line. And lastly, whether you see it or not...the people in this thread "bashing" you...are actually trying to help you, help the breed, and help future owners of the dogs you produce. You're not bettering the breed if you don't really know what you're working with...you're flying blind.

 

[angelbears]

Cathy most of us on this forum are not breeders. We are buyers and quite a few of us have bought from breeder's that from first appearance seem to be ethical breeder's. They answer questions pretty much the same way you have. Well, I have spent 1,000's of dollars on a dog that came from just such a kennel. I appreciate the hard questions that you have been asked and should be asked of any one that produces a litter. The more we can educate through forums like this the less likely inexperienced buyer's will get sub par pups and kennels will have to start ensuring that their stock is suitable for breeding.

 

[coreyc]

I did answer your questions to what I feel you need to know. You are blaming me for something someone else said that I had to go back & read. I can not answer for that person so STOP blaming me for others actions. Then I try to explain to you what health testing I HAVE done & Bam you assume No I didn't do anything. Really! Oh don't worry about buying a pup from me cause I don't feel we would be on the same page... I don't pretend to be the corsi police! I came here to defend myself to a person that was making statements that are untrue & now I have to defend myself against someone who is suppose to be here on a form as support but that seems to not be the case at all! Sounds great! Nothing new here & you wonder why ppl don't come back unless they are your buddy or pal! Keep up the great work!

I'm not blaming you for any thing just wanted to get it right you have not answered the questions have your dogs Penn Hipped? if not they should not be breed ! You say you answered the questions you feel I should know as a breeder you should answer any an all questions a client would have for you not what you feel they should know because it sounds like your hiding some thing red flag . As for getting a pup from you your right we are not on the same page I think were in different books all together been there got taken by a BYB 14 years ago not going to happen again .Please do more research don't bring the breed down any more there is enough people doing it aready

 

[grazefull1]

cathey u should understand y people would have so many question about this breed u can't tell u havent seen very poorly breed corso being sold to unknowing people my husband was one of them n it ticks me off when a person have a question about a breed n the breeder FEELS THEY DONT NEED R HAVE TO KNOW about something there going spend over $1000 that could end up suffering as it gets older just gets to me, it crashies my heart ive seen so many cases like this n im tried of it im sorry but that that comment u said just plan sadden me

 

[Cody]

I did answer your questions to what I feel you need to know. You are blaming me for something someone else said that I had to go back & read. I can not answer for that person so STOP blaming me for others actions. Then I try to explain to you what health testing I HAVE done & Bam you assume No I didn't do anything. Really! Oh don't worry about buying a pup from me cause I don't feel we would be on the same page... I don't pretend to be the corsi police! I came here to defend myself to a person that was making statements that are untrue & now I have to defend myself against someone who is suppose to be here on a form as support but that seems to not be the case at all! Sounds great! Nothing new here & you wonder why ppl don't come back unless they are your buddy or pal! Keep up the great work!

Not sure who you are talking to, but if it is me you really should know there was no bashing, trust me this is as far from bashing as I can get. You're defensive and angry posts are saying more then I have. I simply asked for verification of what one of YOUR puppy buyers said. I would assume that the buyer got their information from their breeder that being you. I don't know you. I honestly really do not care what you do. But when you come onto a forum, with a group of puppy owners who all joined the same day and posted only on one thread, that praises you as their breeder then disappear, it makes people wonder. As for people coming back, if you look at more then this one thread, you will see this forum is about as far from the bashing pages that it can get. There is a great community of people who support each other here, and NO we are far from all friends. I suggest you read a Fila or some of the CC threads to see that . You are more then welcome to stay, read some of the threads and participate in this forum. There are some great people here and a lot that can be learned, regarding all types of mastiffs.

 

[cinnamon roll]

Well said Cody. I think many of us were thinking the same thing.

Not sure who you are talking to, but if it is me you really should know there was no bashing, trust me this is as far from bashing as I can get. You're defensive and angry posts are saying more then I have. I simply asked for verification of what one of YOUR puppy buyers said. I would assume that the buyer got their information from their breeder that being you. I don't know you. I honestly really do not care what you do. But when you come onto a forum, with a group of puppy owners who all joined the same day and posted only on one thread, that praises you as their breeder then disappear, it makes people wonder. As for people coming back, if you look at more then this one thread, you will see this forum is about as far from the bashing pages that it can get. There is a great community of people who support each other here, and NO we are far from all friends. I suggest you read a Fila or some of the CC threads to see that . You are more then welcome to stay, read some of the threads and participate in this forum. There are some great people here and a lot that can be learned, regarding all types of mastiffs.

 

[grazefull1]

Well said Cody. I think many of us were thinking the same thing.

agree lol trust me cody isnt bashing y not just answer with a yes r no ? n even if its a no than from this point on u know what is needed to improve yourself n your dogs we all came here to learn n to do better with ours dogs

 

[catheyscanecorsos]

I have currently penn hipped 3 of my corso and am awiting scores... So please stand by as it does take around 30 days. I have done prelims on my corsi but now we are awaiting penn hipp scores.

 

[Mastiff-Lover]

Cody's right the corso community is fantastic here, any questions or advice everyone is happy and willing to help even if it is just their own personal experiences. Nobody is bashing

 

[cblond1121]

I have a great breeder horror story....

Our breeder accepted a cash payment and a set of rims for our puppy. This was all written in a contract. She was great with us (answered any questions we had, sent us a Christmas card, etc) up until a month and a half later, when we met up with her so she could take the puppy to her vet for his ears to be cropped (There are not many places around us that crop and we liked the job he did on her dogs). When we dropped him off to her, she commented about how nice the puppy looked, etc. She took the money from us for the crop and said she would call us when it was done. A few hours later, we get a message from her saying that if we didn't bring her $XXX.XX in the next 48 hours we would never see our puppy again because she was going to sell him to someone else.

We traveled to her house, an hour away, where she took the puppy (without getting the ears done). The police met us at the house to keep the peace, but said they force her to give the puppy back because contracts are a civil matter (she wasn't happy with the terms of the contract) and in our state dogs are considered personal property. In the end, we gave her the sum of money she wanted because if we didn't, we would have had to take her to court and she would have had possession of the puppy during that time. Or we could have forced our way into her house and took our puppy back, but the bail money and court fees would have cost us the same.

 

[cblond1121]

It has nothing to do with defense...it has everything to do with your responsibility as a breeder. If you feel you have to defend your health testing practices, or temperament testing...you're doing it wrong. These are aspects of breeding that you (as a breeder) should be championing on the forefront, and not things that others have to struggle to get you to divulge. Any breed stock that you use should be health and temperament TESTED...not evaluated by a trainer, not evaluated by your breeder friends...there are 3rd party agencies in place to test and certify your breed stock. The blunt truth is that you absolutely should not be using them if they are not formally tested. No one can look at a puppy and guarantee its health...even if the parents of your breed stock are health tested, that does not mean your dogs will be of sound health...there are recessive traits that can show up in an otherwise healthy line. And lastly, whether you see it or not...the people in this thread "bashing" you...are actually trying to help you, help the breed, and help future owners of the dogs you produce. You're not bettering the breed if you don't really know what you're working with...you're flying blind.

I completely agree.

 

[Cody]

I have currently penn hipped 3 of my corso and am awiting scores... So please stand by as it does take around 30 days. I have done prelims on my corsi but now we are awaiting penn hipp scores.

That is great news Good job!