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Update on my 8 month old - could use some feedback

Petcaredays

Well-Known Member
Hi, thought I'd add some pics of my loyal Cooper since we all like to brag about our babies! (hope attached properly) For some who might have answered my past puppy questions they know that we are first time Fila owners. Of course as luck might have it we didn't know until after we brought him home and fell in love. Thanks to ruthcatrin and her drilling into me that a 4 ft fence is a no-no we're going to rectify this. Thank goodness we're retired and are homebodies otherwise by the sounds of these guys we would have some deep issues on our hands. I want gather as much info as I can to continue to live a happy, healthy and safe life with our pets. When I read some of these posts it terrifies me that our (butter wouldn't melt) fella could turn into something totally unexpected. As with most of you out there our dogs are our life. If I provide some details about his temperament so far could I get some feedback? Is he showing signs of a typical Fila at this age? Should I be looking out for new changes? Oh ya and about his weight...he's 90 lbs. now. We want to be aware.
So far we have taken him to puppy classes, and up to about 5 months he was playing with the little 3 year old next door and actually enjoying the neighbors that came to visit him. Up until about 2 months ago we had dropped him off for a few hours with my daughter at the vet clinic she works at. Initially he barked at each staff member who entered the room (that he had the run in) but after a few soft words enjoyed the attention. My daughter and her spouse came at Xmas for a couple of days. Cooper did the usual bark, head down crouch until they spoke with him (as did we) then he was ok. Actually he had only met the son-in-law once at about 4 mths. and he was fine with him. In fact Cooper took to snoozing on the couch with him(??) He cried when they left. He is learning the ropes from my other 2; barking at strangers (although there are not many where we are) It's actually the highlight of their day when they see some action (lol). I can only think that when the other 2 show acceptance Cooper believes it's ok too. Maybe we've just been lucky so far ?? Speaking of luck (touch wood) he has never destroyed anything in the house. I can't believe it. He's stolen the odd sock but we quickly retrieve them for fear of him eating! Or maybe his mix is softening his temperament?? Like I had mentioned b4 when we got him his vac papers said Presa Canario. Could he be a Presa/Hound mix? If you only heard him you'd swear he was all hound. I have no idea what some of these breeders or so-called breeders pull out there with these dogs. We've always had large breed dogs and although we've had our share of issues we never give up on them and won't start now. 2 things we know for sure: he dislikes other dogs and will definitely be our guard dog....he has a nose and ears that don't miss a thing. Tks!
 

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cinnamon roll

Super Moderator
Super Moderator
He is very handsome. He is not a pure Fila in my opinion. To me the head, muzzle and jowls don't look it to me. Which is probably why he is more accepting of strangers etc.

I can not tell what he is mixed with. Hopefully some others will jump on soon.
 

DennasMom

Well-Known Member
I don't know filas at all, either...
But, I can see how you fell for him - love that sweet expression!

Sounds like you may have a good mix on your hands - very alert, yet willing to accept those that are not considered a "threat"...

At 8 months, I think there's still time for a harder temperament to show, so keep up with all the good socialization you've got going, and hopefully that will help soften his reactions if he does "harden" up to be more fila-esque.
 

Petcaredays

Well-Known Member
Thanks for the sweet comments. He definitely has a nasty side if he wants to use it but as long as we can keep it in check we should be good. I'll wait to see if anyone more familiar with Filas chime in. I wish I could have received more background info on this fella but the original owners have backed away. They originally advertised him as a Mastiff X which is technically true I guess. Unfortunately my ignorance of the breed prevented me from asking the right questions. We thought he was EM X so you can imagine the surprise when we compared their temperments.
 

mountainfila

Well-Known Member
I do not see a fila either, was wondering why you think he is a fila when his vac papers say pressa. I do see the shape of the pressa head and ears, the tail seems to be thick like a lab tail and his fur seems to be thicker then a filas. A fila tail is fatter at the base of the bum and tapers to a fine whip like point, yours stay thick all the way to the end like a lab tail. If he is a pressa mix be careful of his temp towards you and family members, there have been quite a few people that have posted on here about there pressa or pressa mixes turning on them, dont know why but it seems that when people post about them on here it has had to do with aggression issues with the family, check out the pressa forum on here and read some of the posts, you will see what im talking about.

And yes i agree about breeders not being forth coming with the actual breed they are selling, i just seen a "brazillin mastiff" advertised on kijiji for 5 grand and it looks like a mutt, it looks like a pit mix and if someone buys that dog they are going to believe that the dog is a fila because that is what they were told. I think i found the ad in Alberta kijiji , there are a couple adds for "brazillin Mastiff" and yes i know that is not the right spelling , that is how they have it spelled in the ad hahahaha and the pics of the parents do not look like filas either but that is what they are being sold as.
 

Petcaredays

Well-Known Member
I do not see a fila either, was wondering why you think he is a fila when his vac papers say pressa. I do see the shape of the pressa head and ears, the tail seems to be thick like a lab tail and his fur seems to be thicker then a filas. A fila tail is fatter at the base of the bum and tapers to a fine whip like point, yours stay thick all the way to the end like a lab tail. If he is a pressa mix be careful of his temp towards you and family members, there have been quite a few people that have posted on here about there pressa or pressa mixes turning on them, dont know why but it seems that when people post about them on here it has had to do with aggression issues with the family, check out the pressa forum on here and read some of the posts, you will see what im talking about.

And yes i agree about breeders not being forth coming with the actual breed they are selling, i just seen a "brazillin mastiff" advertised on kijiji for 5 grand and it looks like a mutt, it looks like a pit mix and if someone buys that dog they are going to believe that the dog is a fila because that is what they were told. I think i found the ad in Alberta kijiji , there are a couple adds for " brazillin Mastiff" and yes i know that is not the right spelling , that is how they have it spelled in the ad hahahaha and the pics of the parents do not look like filas either but that is what they are being sold as.
Thanks for the helpful feedback. I did as you suggested. We really started to investigate the breed when the 'hound' became so pronounced. His head is not big and square like a Presa and everyone sees Cooper as having a hound face. He howls and 'talks' all the time. Cute but a pain when he really wants attention. The Fila seemed to be the only breed with the hound ancestor. That said...the Presa has a raised hind with his body being longer than his height which describes Cooper. The white paws (cat-like), white on his chest and tip of tail also describe a Presa, and Cooper. His stalking also describes the Presa, and Cooper. The only thing we can come up with is that maybe someone crossed their Presa with a Hound. Presa are known to be playful pups with socialization which is fine but also described as changing the temperament at 2 yrs. So now I'm torn between do I trust that with reasonable training he'll be just fine or worry about what he will change into??? Although we have always managed our large dogs, we are not of the age or energy to spend days on training. Oh, how I hope someone out there can identify with my issues!
 

Hector

Well-Known Member
No matter what breed the dog is, the important thing is to know what makes your dog comfortable or uncomfortable. Don't stop socialization and training. Practice simple obedience in new situations, environments, and distractions. Train and know how to control or call off your dog if your dog ever lunges or becomes highly distracted, whether it be pulling him back, giving a suitable correction, or redirection. If you see that your dog is uncomfortable with people getting into his space, make sure you put a muzzle on him when going to the vet or in any case that he will need to be handled.

Always err on the safe side and always know that your dog is a dog and it can bite at anytime. Not every dog is going to fall into a typical breed say "fila" or "presa" or "EM" personality, it's going to vary from dog to dog.

What are the issues exactly?
 

Petcaredays

Well-Known Member
No matter what breed the dog is, the important thing is to know what makes your dog comfortable or uncomfortable. Don't stop socialization and training. Practice simple obedience in new situations, environments, and distractions. Train and know how to control or call off your dog if your dog ever lunges or becomes highly distracted, whether it be pulling him back, giving a suitable correction, or redirection. If you see that your dog is uncomfortable with people getting into his space, make sure you put a muzzle on him when going to the vet or in any case that he will need to be handled.
Always err on the safe side and always know that your dog is a dog and it can bite at anytime. Not every dog is going to fall into a typical breed say "fila" or "presa" or "EM" personality, it's going to vary from dog to dog.

What are the issues exactly?
Maybe I'm overreacting to some of the comments I've read about both Fila and Presa. My other 2 are guard dogs too, but are not unsafe to the point that they would attack someone without serious provocation. I just don't want to be surprised when he turns 2 or so that I have a different dog. Since the 2 (fila/presa) are different temps I'm just trying to determine what to expect as he gets older. Hope this makes sense. Tks.
 

Hector

Well-Known Member
If you look up some fila temp videos on youtube, you will see how a fila with proper temp will act. It might not kick in at 2 years of age, it can happen at 1.5 yrs or maybe 3 yrs or maybe never. There are varying degrees of ojeriza. The important thing is to practice obedience (simple commands, focus, redirection, attention to name, etc) and loose leash walking skills. If your dog can go through with commands in highly distracting environments (dogs barking/lunging, cats in view, people biking/skateboarding, people walking by, talking to people, going in pet stores, construction noises, crowds, kids yelling and screaming, etc) then I'd say you have pretty good control over your dog.

Continue to proof basic commands, learn how to read your dog, establish a trusting relationship. I have a 19 month fila and I can say he's pretty mild in ojeriza. I don't know if this is due to the continued training or his genetics. I don't worry about his true temperament kicking in. I focus on his training and my ability to handle situations where he becomes reactive. The more you work on these issues, the better control you will have over your dog.

Areas I like to focus in training are recall (how reliable is he? in what situations does he or does he not respond? how do you motivate him?), attention and focus (how well does he respond to his name? how does he react with praise? how fast can I redirect his attn onto me?), response to loose leash commands (how well does he walk on the leash? what does he react to - people, small animals, other dogs? can he stop on a dime when I tell him to?), how attentive is he to my actions/verbal corrections (does he check in? does he look at distractions and give me eye contact for direction? how does he respond when I stop walking? does NO mean anything to my dog?)
 

chuckorlando

Well-Known Member
You really need some pics of the whole dog from the side. But I aint seeing alot of fila. I would say most fila show signs of temp early. They may not be full on but they shy away from people at least. The best thing you can do with a fila, is over react. At least in the way you secure the property and animal, the way you walk the dog and the way you socialize and train. And most certainly on trust. In the end after the fila goes through the crazed maniac everything is a threat stage, the dog needs to trust your judgement. If you think it's ok, the dog needs to thin it's ok.

And even though the dog seems ok, does not mean your not one arm swing away from a bite. So your guard has to be on point and your hold strong and reactions fast. It's my dogs job to bite you. It's my job to keep you from getting bitten.
 

tojvan

Well-Known Member
If you look up some fila temp videos on youtube, you will see how a fila with proper temp will act. It might not kick in at 2 years of age, it can happen at 1.5 yrs or maybe 3 yrs or maybe never. There are varying degrees of ojeriza. The important thing is to practice obedience (simple commands, focus, redirection, attention to name, etc) and loose leash walking skills. If your dog can go through with commands in highly distracting environments (dogs barking/lunging, cats in view, people biking/skateboarding, people walking by, talking to people, going in pet stores, construction noises, crowds, kids yelling and screaming, etc) then I'd say you have pretty good control over your dog.

Continue to proof basic commands, learn how to read your dog, establish a trusting relationship. I have a 19 month fila and I can say he's pretty mild in ojeriza. I don't know if this is due to the continued training or his genetics. I don't worry about his true temperament kicking in. I focus on his training and my ability to handle situations where he becomes reactive. The more you work on these issues, the better control you will have over your dog.

Areas I like to focus in training are recall (how reliable is he? in what situations does he or does he not respond? how do you motivate him?), attention and focus (how well does he respond to his name? how does he react with praise? how fast can I redirect his attn onto me?), response to loose leash commands (how well does he walk on the leash? what does he react to - people, small animals, other dogs? can he stop on a dime when I tell him to?), how attentive is he to my actions/verbal corrections (does he check in? does he look at distractions and give me eye contact for direction? how does he respond when I stop walking? does NO mean anything to my dog?)
I agree with most of the things that you said except for a couple of them. No matter how trained a fila is i would never recommend walking him offleash, it can easily lead to disaster all it takes is 1 mistake. Filas are a guardian breed and will tend to make their own decisions if they feel an imminent threat. Pet stores is also a no in my opinion because of it being congested and kids in the store. you can train a fila to not react to a certain degree and that depends on the level of OJ, but You can not make a fila like strangers and eventually the stress will build up and sooner or later the dog will react.
 

Hector

Well-Known Member
I agree with most of the things that you said except for a couple of them. No matter how trained a fila is i would never recommend walking him offleash, it can easily lead to disaster all it takes is 1 mistake. Filas are a guardian breed and will tend to make their own decisions if they feel an imminent threat. Pet stores is also a no in my opinion because of it being congested and kids in the store. you can train a fila to not react to a certain degree and that depends on the level of OJ, but You can not make a fila like strangers and eventually the stress will build up and sooner or later the dog will react.

Loose leash walking skills doesn't mean offleash. It is up to how comfortable the owner is to take the dog to the pet store. I take Hector to the local pet stores. One has more room than the other. I make sure he has enough space from people. Stress will not build up if he has enough space where he does not feel closed in or threatened. If there's too many people in there, I put him back in the car. My fila is not like your fila. He doesn't react the way your dog does when he sees people. I do not allow him to react just because he sees people. I engage and focus and socialize him enough to a point we can walk past people. He has become aloof to people unless they get too close and I tell people that's as close as you can get. The key is knowing your dog.
 

tojvan

Well-Known Member
Loose leash walking skills doesn't mean offleash. It is up to how comfortable the owner is to take the dog to the pet store. I take Hector to the local pet stores. One has more room than the other. I make sure he has enough space from people. Stress will not build up if he has enough space where he does not feel closed in or threatened. If there's too many people in there, I put him back in the car. My fila is not like your fila. He doesn't react the way your dog does when he sees people. I do not allow him to react just because he sees people. I engage and focus and socialize him enough to a point we can walk past people. He has become aloof to people unless they get too close and I tell people that's as close as you can get. The key is knowing your dog.
That was my mistake i read it wrong, you're right loose leash walking does not mean offleash lol. The temperament videos i posted were to just show his raw temperament without me getting involved whatsoever, no command no correction etc.I'll post another one where i have more of an active role. Like i said before every fila has their own individual personality and level of OJ, but I'm willing to vouch that 95% of the fila owners don't take their fila's inside pet stores, not because they can't but because there are too many variables all it takes is one time. Now this is my own personal opinion and beliefs. I'm not saying what's right or wrong, these are just my views on the topic.
 

chuckorlando

Well-Known Member
I agree with you ad disagree all at one time. I agree that all dogs dont act the same. Even all fila. But I disagree with the notion that with enough walking or socializing is a broad spectrum solution for their aggression. We have up to 80 people at our house multiple times a year. I can walk kona any where I want, around anyone I want. She is very well socialied and trust my judgement 100%. But if you move your arm to fast, no question, she will try to bite you. I consider fila a protection dog not a guard dog. It is in their dna to protect you in a split second using only their judgement.

Of coarse, you should know your dog and it might be just fine. But I dont want any one to confuse what works for one animal, as a solution for the aggression as a whole breed. There are some lines all the socializing in the world wont calm the maniac. Some rightly wont give a damn how much you like a person as any and all people are a true threat to them
Loose leash walking skills doesn't mean offleash. It is up to how comfortable the owner is to take the dog to the pet store. I take Hector to the local pet stores. One has more room than the other. I make sure he has enough space from people. Stress will not build up if he has enough space where he does not feel closed in or threatened. If there's too many people in there, I put him back in the car. My fila is not like your fila. He doesn't react the way your dog does when he sees people. I do not allow him to react just because he sees people. I engage and focus and socialize him enough to a point we can walk past people. He has become aloof to people unless they get too close and I tell people that's as close as you can get. The key is knowing your dog.
 

Hector

Well-Known Member
Of coarse, you should know your dog and it might be just fine. But I dont want any one to confuse what works for one animal, as a solution for the aggression as a whole breed. There are some lines all the socializing in the world wont calm the maniac. Some rightly wont give a damn how much you like a person as any and all people are a true threat to them

That's true. A dog like that shouldn't be taken out to public anyway. I'm not suggesting it is a solution, but an encouragement to work with the dog and get a better understanding of the dog.
 

chuckorlando

Well-Known Member
Yep knowing what you have is the key to it all. It's easy to give broad spectrum advice ultimately you will learn your dog and it's bounds. No one size fits all. The good thing about starting with a puppy, you have a chance to learn the bounds before the dog is big enough to hurt people. If the dog is larger, I would err on the side of caution.