Training collars

[jsavoni]

Hey All,
I just wanted everyones opinion on training collars. Sofia is pretty goold on walks and everything. But i was thinking of getting a choke collar for when she gets overly excited for dogs and people and lunges to get to them. Most of the time i have a harness on her and its the one that is suppose to turn them around. When she lunges it doesnt turn her around at all. I basically have to grab the front of the harness and hold her down until she settles down and listens to my commands, which she eventually does do.

I was just wanted all of your opinions on this, and your experience with this topic. I havent really wanted to do it this way because all the training has been with treats, which has worked great, until she gets so excited that nothing i have makes her listen.

Now i am leaning more towards holding her down in her harness for a bit longer, i think she will start to understand that she isnt going to get what she wants by not listening. but i have been debating it...

 

[Hector]

I don't like to use a choke chain, but I use something similar which is a slip lead. I have one that has a adjustable tab so you can control how much slack there is on the leash when loose. The slip lead is situated like a prong and when my dog gets too excited or won't listen, I'd have to use it to get his attention or until he calms himself down by the choke. I'd rather use the prong though. With a slip leash and a small pup, you can pick them off the ground. I'd still rather not use that until I've worked more on the dogs focus and desensitization to triggers first. Use distance.

 

[gamestaff]

well used, a choke is a great training tool. the problem is that most people have no idea how to use one. find a trainer in your area who is experienced with the breed. they will show you how to use the tool properly. you are in the east, there are very many highly trained corsos and corso handlers in a reasonable proximity to you. scrap the harness, it will work as well as you are seeing it do.

 

[jsavoni]

yea if i decided to try a choke collar i would definatly want to make sure i am using it right. I would try a prong possibly to, but that would be if my pup decides she all of a sudden doesnt want to listen to me at all.

 

[DMikeM]

Martingale or prong collar are far safer than any choke type collar.

 

[mountainfila]

I hate when people use the term "choke" collar cause it far from chokes them and to me a prong is a lazy mans training collar, thats just me. A choke chain is not used to choke the dog, if your dog is pulling and you just pull back yes you will choke the dog but a choker is used by quickly flicking the leash like when you flick someone with a towel, its quick. And a choker should be fitted with only about 4 inches of slack and before putting it on hold the collar up an look at it, it will look like the letter P, your also facing the dog when you do this and then put it over the head, that why you are set for walking the dog on the left side and it will be loose and slide when you give a correction. Trust me they learn quick and it does not hurt the dog, my bf had no idea there was a certain way to put on a choker, i see him looking at the collar now before putting it on the dog whoop whoop you can teach an ol dawg new tricks hahahahaha

Harnesses are only for tracking and pulling, not training ,period or for dogs under 30 lbs, they are useless for our powerfull breeds

 

[ruthcatrin]

Some dogs will pull right on through a choke collar unfortunetly, its something to keep in mind as you're working on training. At least with a martingale it can only tighten so far which limits the damage a dog can do to himself. My personal preference would be a martingale, and if thats not enough to get through her head then a prong. Regardless though a trainer who knows what they're doing and can show you how to use which ever collar correclty is essential.

 

[2nd Chance]

I have a preference for flat collars. My reason being. When walking my dogs, they collectively weight of my 3 dogs is 160kg. That's 330lbs. I cant allow them to pull me around. I break easier these days, dont bounce so well either!

I personally believe check chains are for my entertainment, as i see those at the GSD club wearing them upside down, and thus being dragged around by their dogs. Very very funny to watch when its not you.

I like the gutsy diagnostic aspect of a flat collar. eg. Dog is pulling me. I dont have control over him. Simple.

 

[mountainfila]

Some dogs will pull right on through a choke collar unfortunetly, its something to keep in mind as you're working on training. At least with a martingale it can only tighten so far which limits the damage a dog can do to himself. My personal preference would be a martingale, and if thats not enough to get through her head then a prong. Regardless though a trainer who knows what they're doing and can show you how to use which ever collar correclty is essential.

If they are pulling through a choke collar then the person walking it doesnt know how to use the collar, i checked that leerburg collar out, always willing to learn, i like that it sits up behind ears and snug so it cant slip down, but as soon as i read its for cutting off the air to the dog thats were they lost me, thats even worse then the prong, even the choke collar does not cut the air off, for a split second maybe but does not deprive the dog from breathing.

Maybe i read it wrong but it just seems wrong to to me but then again i had to revamp my training routine as i am training 3, 10 month old fila pups no leash and no collars, not easy mg: so always looking for new training aids to try but probably will always stick with a choker, it works for me.

 

[gamestaff]

the choke chain isn't meant to be an anti-pull tool. most dogs will pull on a choke. as was mentioned, it would be better termed a correction chain. it is meant to be a tool to correct unwanted behaviour, whatever that may be. it is an effective form of correcting. you certainly can use one and cause damage or death to whatever is wearing it, but this is so far from the point of it. "I hate when people use the term "choke" collar cause it far from chokes them and to me a prong is a lazy mans training collar, thats just me. A choke chain is not used to choke the dog, if your dog is pulling and you just pull back yes you will choke the dog but a choker is used by quickly flicking the leash like when you flick someone with a towel, its quick. " -mountainfila is dead right. this tool isn't used in EVERY area of professionally trained dogs who are working on a leash (with the exception of tracking) for no reason.....

 

[ruthcatrin]

If they are pulling through a choke collar then the person walking it doesnt know how to use the collar, i checked that leerburg collar out, always willing to learn, i like that it sits up behind ears and snug so it cant slip down, but as soon as i read its for cutting off the air to the dog thats were they lost me, thats even worse then the prong, even the choke collar does not cut the air off, for a split second maybe but does not deprive the dog from breathing.

Maybe i read it wrong but it just seems wrong to to me but then again i had to revamp my training routine as i am training 3, 10 month old fila pups no leash and no collars, not easy mg: so always looking for new training aids to try but probably will always stick with a choker, it works for me.

Apollo pulls through a choke if his guardian kicks in, and yes we worked with a trainer to make sure we were using it right. He doesn't care that by dragging me he's cutting off his air, and no, a quick snap correction doesn't stop him either. A prong is uncomfortable enough to pull on that it reminds him he's not supposed to be dragging me towards whatever he's having a problem with.

 

[ruthcatrin]

Now yes, for non-pulling problems the choke chain with a quick snap correction would get his attention, but not for pulling. And the prong not only solves the pulling problem much more effectively for him, it does it without risking cutting off his air supply and without risking damage to his throat that pulling on a flat or choke collar can cause.

 

[mountainfila]

Maybe its cause he has a big ruff around his neck its less effective, i donno i dont do hairy dogs hahaha

 

[ruthcatrin]

It was definetly cutting off his air, cause he'd cough and choke after the fact. Drove me nuts cause he was basically doing it to himself and that makes it a risk for thyroid problems, damaged trachea, damaged blood supply...... Though yes, the ruff does change how collars affect him....if only cause it makes it hard to fit one to him properly! Which is another reason why I like martingales lol.

 

[Duetsche_Doggen]

Isn't that what they are training collars, whatever works for you and your dog. I use prongs, easy to fit, ease of use, cheap, with a black and white message. I agree with mountainfila about harnesses to me its still a harness but anything that motivates some type of "training" lack as it may be......IMO

 

[mountainfila]

Just curious with all these prong users , how do your dogs act when they are not wearing one? Do you get the same reactions when you ask commands or walk without one, do you have control without one is what im asking. I ask because my coonhound was a smart cookie, she was an obedience champ with a choker on but a complete A-HOLE with a flat collar on. She knew she could pull the arm out of my socket with a flat collar on, but perfect heel everytime with a choker on lol.

Mine react more to the chink, chink,chink noise of the chain, in a heel walk if one of mine get a little past my knee all i have to do is make the chain slide through the ring and they get back at heel, no tightning.

 

[ruthcatrin]

It depends. We've most "weaned" Apollo off the prong for daily use, because I needed to be able to take him to AKC shows without one. And he does alright. But the regular collar still won't stop him if the guardian kicks in so I have to pay extra attention, which I try to do anyway.....he still perks up though if I get out the prong becuase he knows it means we're going someplace different. With the prong on, he rarely even starts to pull any more, even when the guardian kicks in, he clearly knows that pulling with the prong is uncomfortable and he doesn't try. There are some places I'll probly always use the prong, the vets office for example. To much close quarters with to many other dogs and people I can't control.

 

[Duetsche_Doggen]

Mountainfila, prongs are just that a training tool. Say you give a command they ignore you, "remind" them, done. My dogs listen with or without one but for certain distractions I have to "remind" them. Just like a "choke" Eventually you wean them off. I don't don't how everyone else trains their dogs, but with Thor. I think I had him wearing the collar for about 2 months. 200lbs of dog being walked on a flat buckle collar. Stone I haven't worked with much but its been about 3 weeks? to a month, and we've made some great progress. He requires some more work but we did a test run for CGC all flat buckle and he did very well. See my post called "Stoned" for the full background.

Like people different training methods for different dogs. My goal with any training tool is to eventually use a flat buckle and eventually "off leash" with distractions. Of course I don't have Filas though :lol: They might need a "tighter" reminder.

 

[Hector]

Just curious with all these prong users , how do your dogs act when they are not wearing one? Do you get the same reactions when you ask commands or walk without one, do you have control without one is what im asking. I ask because my coonhound was a smart cookie, she was an obedience champ with a choker on but a complete A-HOLE with a flat collar on. She knew she could pull the arm out of my socket with a flat collar on, but perfect heel everytime with a choker on lol.

Mine react more to the chink, chink,chink noise of the chain, in a heel walk if one of mine get a little past my knee all i have to do is make the chain slide through the ring and they get back at heel, no tightning.

Hector is a pro with a prong on. With the slightest flick of the leash, he's like oh shit...We've been walking for two weeks with a prong - it's easier for me to communicate to him. Walked him with a martingale yesterday and he did great, but he saw kids and got excited and then it was tug o war for a little. I think we're gonna have to walk with a prong on and off until I have better focus when he's distracted. I'd say he's manageable without the prong, but I haven't had to deal with him lunging at anyone or thing yet. He knows I mean business when the prong is on him, he's no dummy.