List Of CAFIB Breeders?

[jake1420]

Is there an up to date list of CAFIB breeders anywhere? I've been looking and when I find one most of the links do not work man its hard to find. USA ones is ok too as long as the dogs are true. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks.

 

[kshymkiw]

http://www.cafibbrasil.com.br/cafib-brasil-coberturas-fila-brasileiro.php

That is the CAFIB Announcement Section. You could take the names from there, and then plug those into Google. The most 'noted' CAFIB Breeder is Itahandu out of Brazil - http://www.canilitanhandu.com/filabrasileiro-breeder.html

Depending on how you personally feel about breeding situations, will decide on who you go with. I know Juan got his dog from Itahandu, so you could ask him. I personally have no respect for the guy and his wife. They have close to 70 dogs, and have a staff that helps to run their kennel...

 

[aceoutdoor]

http://www.cafibbrasil.com.br/cafib-brasil-coberturas-fila-brasileiro.php

That is the CAFIB Announcement Section. You could take the names from there, and then plug those into Google. The most 'noted' CAFIB Breeder is Itahandu out of Brazil - http://www.canilitanhandu.com/filabrasileiro-breeder.html

Depending on how you personally feel about breeding situations, will decide on who you go with. I know Juan got his dog from Itahandu, so you could ask him. I personally have no respect for the guy and his wife. They have close to 70 dogs, and have a staff that helps to run their kennel...

Thank you for telling it like it is. I wish there was an international database for hip dysplasia reporting. There have been some sad videos of pups from "certain" kennels that are horrific. Incidentally they ALWAYS disappear a month or two after posting.

 

[dogman#1]

Hey Jake,

Fortunately/unfortunately (whichever way you want to look at it) CAFIB breeders in the states dont really advertise that much, only one that I know of has a website (Carioca). most of the kennels in the states are breeding for themselves and trading pups with each other in an attempt to preserve certain bloodlines and to better the breed.... they may, on occasion have a pup or 2 for sale but that is dependent on the size of the litter and how many they plan to keep for themselves. I have seen multiple litters end up between 1-3 hands and these are litters of over 10! with no profits being made (more like loses) and no "real" amount of pups being sold there really isnt a need (or funds) to advertise. I always let people know when there is a litter on the ground that is worth looking at but unfortunately that doesnt always translate to "available" pups. Your best bet is to go ahead and get on a breeders list and hope that something that matches what you want is available soon, or you can go the non CAFIB route and check craigslist, ebay, and get the "breeder's pick" for 500 bucks anytime you want! lol, just kidding, dont do that.

 

[kshymkiw]

Thank you for telling it like it is. I wish there was an international database for hip dysplasia reporting. There have been some sad videos of pups from "certain" kennels that are horrific. Incidentally they ALWAYS disappear a month or two after posting.

That is what I go for. Just try to do as much homework as you can. I have heard horror stories from Brazil. I have heard people getting scammed for $10k or more. Dogs that have bad hips, parasites, crooked legs, etc...

Not to say there isn't a good breeder down there, but I think it would be harder to find. Pursuing any legal action against a breeder in Brazil should something go wrong, is going to be hard, and they know this.

Also FWIW, I believe the Guy who owns Itahandu is a Lawyer, and his wife is a Doctor. If I remember correctly.

 

[aceoutdoor]

There is plenty of info on them out there. We should always try to improve the breed, which is the last concern of some people. And I must say 70 dogs, if thats true, WOW, you would have to have a staff.

 

[angelbears]

Juan is the only one that I know of that has had good dealings with them. I have read some old post in old fila groups were they are good about replacing a dog but you have to pay for shipping each tme plus the cost of the original dog. I read were one person had to pay for shipping 3 times before they got a good dog. Personally, I wouldn't buy from anyone that has more than one litter on the ground at a time and they are raising them in the home.

 

[aceoutdoor]

http://www.delalunakennel.com/information/experience-with-itanhandu/

 

[dogman#1]

Hey guys... Am I really the only person you guys know that had good dealings with itanhandu? I know at least a dozen in the states and at least a hundred just on my FB friends list alone! I have personally helped facilitate the importing of some dogs (no, Im not a broker nor do I get paid for this) from Itanhandu for multiple people (some friends, some acquaintances, some that were just scared of dealing with oversees kennels) and only once did a dog come out not right..a dog came out with crepitus (sp?) at about 6 mths of age and they replaced him as their contract stated. I have yet to see a breeder anywhere in the world that covers shipping as part of their guarantee, ofcourse you are always welcome to pick up from their kennel. The problems rise when you realize that shipping was over 500USD (know it is close to 1K!) but these are things you need to consider when making your purchase beforehand. I personally went to their kennel and while they had alot of dogs (maxed out in kennel space) it was not 70 dogs but more like 60s...seems like alot, right? well seeing that some were seniors (that's right they keep all their dogs till they expire) and some were pups you are left with about 30 breeding adults with about 25 of them being females... If they were the puppy mill that some would have you believe then they WOULD breed each female atleast once a year but that isnt the case. when I was there there was 1 litter on the ground and 2 older pups that they bought from other kennels for themselves... there were some females that were 3-4 years old that had never been bred yet. Their kennels were impeccable and each dog had a really decent size run. all had fresh water and all knew both Cintia and Gershon. while cintia did not handle the dogs much Gershon went into each kennel and played with the dogs as he told me about each one. Gerson is a lawyer, Cintia is involved in dentistry but not sure if she is actually a dentist and they own a liquor manufacturing plant. to say that they live off of their dogs is a little nuts as by brazil standards they are VERY well off. they have had more champions then any other kennel and are actively involved within the CAFIB community. They do put out alot of dogs but they have the means to take care of those dogs and while some may turn out bad the vast majority turn out very good and some great ones. I have yet to see a kennel of any breed produce a great dog in EVERY litter with zero bad dogs forever.... just has not and will not happen.

 

[kshymkiw]

Hey guys... Am I really the only person you guys know that had good dealings with itanhandu? I know at least a dozen in the states and at least a hundred just on my FB friends list alone! I have personally helped facilitate the importing of some dogs (no, Im not a broker nor do I get paid for this) from Itanhandu for multiple people (some friends, some acquaintances, some that were just scared of dealing with oversees kennels) and only once did a dog come out not right..a dog came out with crepitus (sp?) at about 6 mths of age and they replaced him as their contract stated. I have yet to see a breeder anywhere in the world that covers shipping as part of their guarantee, ofcourse you are always welcome to pick up from their kennel. The problems rise when you realize that shipping was over 500USD (know it is close to 1K!) but these are things you need to consider when making your purchase beforehand. I personally went to their kennel and while they had alot of dogs (maxed out in kennel space) it was not 70 dogs but more like 60s...seems like alot, right? well seeing that some were seniors (that's right they keep all their dogs till they expire) and some were pups you are left with about 30 breeding adults with about 25 of them being females... If they were the puppy mill that some would have you believe then they WOULD breed each female atleast once a year but that isnt the case. when I was there there was 1 litter on the ground and 2 older pups that they bought from other kennels for themselves... there were some females that were 3-4 years old that had never been bred yet. Their kennels were impeccable and each dog had a really decent size run. all had fresh water and all knew both Cintia and Gershon. while cintia did not handle the dogs much Gershon went into each kennel and played with the dogs as he told me about each one. Gerson is a lawyer, Cintia is involved in dentistry but not sure if she is actually a dentist and they own a liquor manufacturing plant. to say that they live off of their dogs is a little nuts as by brazil standards they are VERY well off. they have had more champions then any other kennel and are actively involved within the CAFIB community. They do put out alot of dogs but they have the means to take care of those dogs and while some may turn out bad the vast majority turn out very good and some great ones. I have yet to see a kennel of any breed produce a great dog in EVERY litter with zero bad dogs forever.... just has not and will not happen.

I am not trying to insist they are a Puppy Mill, but having 30 breeding dogs, is a lot. I would expect to have heard much better about them for being as Involved in CAFIB as they are, but the negative reviews with them certainly outweigh the positives with them, from my own research.

They are a kennel that has to have a staff to run it....at that point I am thinking that is a bit excessive. Obviously they don't make a living off of the dogs, but it certainly is adding quite a bit of money to their already large incomes. From what I also heard, their staff picks the dogs that breed, not the owners. Which to me looks like the owners are just providing their name, space, and the fact they speak English. While their staff are the ones running the actual show.

 

[aceoutdoor]

According De La Luna they speak perfect English until you have a problem and then its "no speak English". Sounds exactly what you would hear from the California puppy mill. The same thing applies, if you know them personally or you live nearby and pick your pup up you may be ok, but if you ship it and you don't know them, be prepared. Sad when you consider Filas are REALLY man's best friend, above all breeds. No one should defend these people on either side. And for those that just assume all CAFIB breeders are on the up and up, do some research. If you have the time, will and love of the breed there is alot out there to digest.

 

[dogman#1]

That is not true... I dont know where you guys are getting your info from but i am here to tell you it is hearsay. yes, 30 dogs is alot and obviously if you have 30 animals you will need help. I have 3 and my wife and children help me. Cintia speaks English, not 100% fluent but good enough to carry a normal conversation. If the conversation gets technical then her English is not up to that. Having multiple champions in CAFIB, multiple best producers, multiple best exhibitors, multiple international champions, investing in educational and informational documents that are not only time but financial consuming does make them pretty involved in the breed in a positive way. The part that their farm hands are the ones picking the breedings is almost laughable.... visit their farm that is open to anyone that wants to, just ask and you would change your mind. 30 breeding dogs is alot but they dont have anywhere close to 30 breedings a year...they have what, 6, 7, 8? this means that at the very least they dont breed half of their breeding stock every year... they have waiting lists for specific breedings, they have countless bloodlines in their yard (some of those bloodlines only exist in their yard now). If I had the space and finances to keep that amount of dogs I would as it would make it easier for me to reach the specific goal I have in mind (type wise). Now do they make the best decisions as far as breeding??? well that is their decision as that is their breeding program. I do like some of their breedings and others...not so much and again those are their decisions and not anyone else's. like I said before they have produced MANY litters and have hundreds of happy and repeat customers if there are 10-15 bad reviews that is a very low percentage... I recently bought another dog from them and I am very happy with what I got.

 

[Dogue]

I read the De Luna blog and it might be sour grapes. Maybe she didn't win a blue ribbon from her Itanhandu import at one of her dog shows or maybe her Fila showed correct temperament and bit the judge when that judge squeezed her Fila's groin? We'll never know. But one sour grape blog against hundreds of happy Itanhandu Fila customers says sour grapes.

 

[chuckorlando]

I dont know nothing about them. But just from reading I have two points.

1st. Fila's are people driven yea? Theres no way 20-30-70 dogs are getting the personal attention this breed needs. Absolutly no way short of free/slave labor and one person per dog for hours a day. Thats not to say they dont have great dogs though. I dont know.

2nd. I dont see a problem with hired help picking the dogs to bread in some cases. In a larger nursery you typicly pay for a nuserymen. Someone who's hired to run the nusery as thats what they know. They know every aspect of growing, they might watch sales trends, they work on hybrids. The owners of the nursery get all the credit but rarely do the real work. It's a business.

 

[Duetsche_Doggen]

I don't know anything abou them either but they were one of one my choices for breeder prospects. I've done some research on and off but nothing "intense" as of yet. If the number of dogs is true I agree that is a lot, IMO.

 

[aceoutdoor]

I read the De Luna blog and it might be sour grapes. Maybe she didn't win a blue ribbon from her Itanhandu import at one of her dog shows or maybe her Fila showed correct temperament and bit the judge when that judge squeezed her Fila's groin? We'll never know. But one sour grape blog against hundreds of happy Itanhandu Fila customers says sour grapes.

The owner of De La Luna is a nice, honest lady to the best of my knowledge. I believe her expectations were too high and she may be a bit of a perfectionist. That being said there is no reason for it to ever lead to "no speak English". That is very dishonest. One sour grape... Like I said research. Anyone can post something on the internet for any reason. You can even go on wikipedia and delete the existing internationally recognized Fila standard and replace it with your own, right Juan? But when there are complaint after complaint you should use some caution. I believe some of those puppy vids were downloaded before they were deleted, I will contact a friend who collects info like that and see if he has them. We should help people be informed puppy owners, and if the truth hurts, well its hurts.

http://www.ripoffreport.com/dog-breeders/gerson-cintia-de-bar/gerson-cintia-de-barros-cani-ba9zf.htm

http://www.ripoffreport.com/dog-breeders/canil-de-itanhandu/canil-de-itanhandu-fila-guara-39eac.htm

 

[angelbears]

I had forgotten about Donna. Cafib kennel or not I wouldn't buy outside of the states. Just too much risk with very little legal recourse. I also think that it is a mighty hard trip for a puppy to make in the belly of a plane.

 

[dogman#1]

Ace, remember I replaced the cbkc standard with the CAFIB standard and BOTH are official and internationally recognized in Wiki, where ANYONE is not only allowed but encouraged to change so.... your point is a bit mute. Itanhandu's guarantee is written and posted in black and white...if the dog falls under that guarantee and you want a replacement then you MUST send the dog back (it doesnt matter if it across the street or across the world). If you are a breeder and you got emotionally attached to that dog and refuse to send it back then it is you who are not abiding by the contract and not the breeder of your dog. Yes, it would be nice if they would just send you another dog but that is not what it states on their guarantee... you cannot fault them because you got too attached to a dog.

Itanhandu is not your regular hobby breeder.. they are HUGE nd have alot of dogs. They have 2 farm hands that handle the dogs daily for hours on end and when Gershon goes there he handles them as well. the dogs are obviously bonded to them as I couldnt just walk up on any of them. Imagine if you have a regular 9-5 and leave your dog at a "day care" of sorts until you get back... does that make you a bad pet owner? fine these arent really "Pets" to them as they seem to be more involved on the actual preservation and breeding aspect of the dogs as uppose to the love and companionship of them but they are far from a mill as a mill leaves dogs w/ NO attention and in filthy conditions and that isnt the case here. There are always 2 sides to every story and the thing with Donna is an on going thing with malisciousness on both sides, it is ugly and I wish it would come to an end.

 

[aceoutdoor]

In a rare compliment to Juan I will say his dogs are some of the best looking CAFIB type. Just not my thing, but I have no problem with those who seek that type, its a free country, for now. And who uses that standard besides their own judges Juan? BTW did Prince Charles make it to the expo this year?

 

[chuckorlando]

It would take 15hr per man per day for each dog to get 1hr. Like I said, it aint possible for them to get the attention they would want. Good or bad, I dont know. But it aint happening. That dont make them bad folks. I'm just saying