traits skipping generations

[llong3316]

Is it rare to see pups hit the ground without any of the parents traits color, temperment etc?

 

[ruthcatrin]

depends on the traits

 

[KristieD]

I don't think I would call it rare so much as I would call it certain parameters have to be met for it to happen. Certain colors can skip generations for a long time before they are popped up for sure. Our pup has a trait that came out, so I can show you an example. His mom is a formentino CC, his dad an all black CC. He turned out black and tan which is recessive in some CCs meaning both parents had to have the gene for the color pattern to come out in their litter. His temperament is very typical CC, fits to a T what everyone has told me to expect and is exactly as we were expecting to come from his parents. So if you mean have no traits at all all at once not show up I am not sure about that since I have no experience with it, but you can definitely have different colors show up.

Here is what they all look like for a visual, along with a brother and sister. Just a note, the siblings are much younger than he is in the pictures I have. I think they were something like 3-4 weeks in those pics, he is 9 weeks in his so the age difference might make it seem more exaggerated. His siblings all look just like mom and dad, but his colors on the other hand are very different and most people mistake him for a rotty mix.

Dad

Mom

Siblings

Our puppy, Odin.

 

[mountainfila]

Looks to me like momma had a one night stand with the sneaky neighborhood rotti lol, its possible to have multiple sires of a litter. If you are concerned you could have a DNA test done on the the mom and dad and the pup, then you will know for sure, its relatively inexpensive, ask your vet.

 

[taraann81]

I know next to nothing about corso, so this may be uneducated...but pic of mom does not look like the formentino Im familiar with.... It looks like a dilute form of black and tan.

 

[ruthcatrin]

I know next to nothing about corso, so this may be uneducated...but pic of mom does not look like the formentino Im familiar with.... It looks like a dilute form of black and tan.

A dilute black and tan would look like Mooshi and be blue and tan. (though to be fair I'm not sure they've figured out formentino genetically, so I suppose its possible mom's a "formentino black and tan)

I will agree that she,s got different markings, but black and tan is a known recessive in Corso lines so all that the pup's colors mean is that both parents carry it.

 

[taraann81]

A dilute black and tan would look like Mooshi and be blue and tan. (though to be fair I'm not sure they've figured out formentino genetically, so I suppose its possible mom's a "formentino black and tan)

I will agree that she,s got different markings, but black and tan is a known recessive in Corso lines so all that the pup's colors mean is that both parents carry it.

i was thinking more akin to a red dobe.....perhaps dilite was the wrong wording

 

[ruthcatrin]

Ah, "dilute" would be incorrect yes. The "red" dobie is actually showing the chocolate/liver gene. It is a recessive gene, but not a dilute, the dilute of liver is isobell. Now that you point that out: the above female does appear have red nose leather, which would usually indicate the liver gene instead of the blue nose usually seen in formentino, though she otherwise looks fawn with dark (blue or black) sable.

And I think we wandered abit from the original question! Lol

 

[KristieD]

Sorry, didn't mean to derail the thread! Was just trying to show an example of a pup having a completely different color from the parents. I don't know all that much about most genes and traits but I did read up on the B/T trait since our pup has it and learned about how it was recessive and could go generations without being noticed and passed on with no B/T pups. It's so funny that you could look back generations and have no idea your dogs are carrying the trait. Until you get an Odin one day and then know both your dogs carry it. Makes breeding out disqualifying colors a real pain in the butt for breeders I bet I find it really interesting to read about though a bit confusing at times when you start getting in to dilutes and patterns and all that other stuff I know nothing about haha.

The mom very well could be something other than a formentino. I asked on the forums in another thread what to call her color because I wasn't sure what it was, and it was suggested she was a formentino with the fault of not having a black mask and since everyone here is WAY more experienced than me, I agreed!

 

[ruthcatrin]

If she really was "liver" she'd not have that sabling (the darker hairs), so formentino is as good as guess as any. Did you actually meet her? She looks impressive.

 

[llong3316]

Actually thats interestjng because I have a dogo but my corso was a blk brindle but his mom was blue and his dad was a dark red. So in the corso world it probably happens more than other breeds.

 

[ruthcatrin]

I don't know that the corso has more of it than other breeds? I think its just that they are a comparitively "newly re-created" breed and so the respectable breeders are still having to work to eliminate the colors they don't want from the lines. Where the breeds that have been around for longer have had more time to eleminate or just out right bury the colors they don't want.

We had a discussion not to long ago down in the EM section about piebald EMs for example, never mind the fluffy gene that pops up in that breed fairly frequently!